Damn water pump!

[The MaDDeSTMaN]

The other day, I decided to replace the water pump on my 2L Mk II Escort, as it had started leaking between the pump itself and the block, and therefore it was losing coolant and pressure in the cooling system, and of course getting a bit too hot after running for 5 minutes or more. I thought to myself I might as well replace the entire thing, seeing as the old one is probably not exactly in the best condition.

Pulled the old one off, and yes indeed, I was right, it wasn't exactly in the best condition anymore, the imprellor blades were corroded down to almost nothing - basically if I hadn't replaced it then anyway, it would have needed to be replaced soon enough anyway.

While pulling it off, I noticed (after pulling out the radiator and everything else covering it) that the reason it had been leaking was because one of the bolts holding the water pump on had come undone, and was now missing! :

Long story short, I ended up getting another bolt to suit, put it in, and as it was getting nice and tight, it suddenly became a lot easier to turn. To the point where I can easily turn it with my fingers. Keep in mind that this bolt is holding the water pump to the block of the engine, and the cooling system is pressurised, so when the engine is running, that bolt is working against the pressure of the cooling system.

And the bl*ody thing won't hold the water pump in place! :

Anybody got any ideas, or experienced this problem themselves? I'm wondering if the thread that the bolt screws into on the block is ruined, if this is possible, and if it is, what can I do about it - I'm not exactly in a financial position to be able to afford to replace the block itself. :(

[LuvinmyEB]

Do they still sell Locktite (or however it's spelt) in a red bottle? I used to have heaps of it... :

[LuvinmyEB]

Or a cheaper altenative might be to find someone with a welder and get the exhaust fixed on the yellow eski for now.

[svo347]

re-tap the hole with a larger size, or a helicoil would be your best bet mate.

[T3man]

Yep, a helicoil will fix it. Instructions come in the kit and they work fine.

Normal threadlock won't work. But there is also an epoxy based paste called "magic stick" or something similar which I have also used in similar circumstances and it is a permanent repair. Only problem is that it may be very difficult to remove the stud next time you have to service the pump. I'm not sure how well it "comes apart". I have used it on a stripped exhaust stud thread on my boat (diesel) and it has held for years. I haven't tried undoing it yet to see what may happen.

[The MaDDeSTMaN]

Originally Posted by svo347

re-tap the hole with a larger size, or a helicoil would be your best bet mate.

Originally Posted by T3man

Yep, a helicoil will fix it. Instructions come in the kit and they work fine.

Normal threadlock won't work. But there is also an epoxy based paste called "magic stick" or something similar which I have also used in similar circumstances and it is a permanent repair. Only problem is that it may be very difficult to remove the stud next time you have to service the pump. I'm not sure how well it "comes apart". I have used it on a stripped exhaust stud thread on my boat (diesel) and it has held for years. I haven't tried undoing it yet to see what may happen.

Ok, so locktite won't help it? Damn! I knew I should have waited for more answers to this thread before going out and buying anything : Oh well, I guess this strongest-strength Locktite stick will come in handy, sooner or later...

Ok, where should I be able to get this "helicoil" from, and how much would it be worth? And what is it exactly?

BTW, thanks everybody for your replies, as I'm sure you can imagine, I was pretty worried when I started this thread.

[LuvinmyEB]

Originally Posted by The MaDDeSTMaN

Ok, so locktite won't help it? Damn! I knew I should have waited for more answers to this thread before going out and buying anything : Oh well, I guess this strongest-strength Locktite stick will come in handy, sooner or later...

Ok, where should I be able to get this "helicoil" from, and how much would it be worth? And what is it exactly?

BTW, thanks everybody for your replies, as I'm sure you can imagine, I was pretty worried when I started this thread.

Why doesn't the Loctite work?
If it works on planes, bikes, boats and other cars it should fix the problem your having.

[T3man]

Mate, try the loctite now you have it but I doubt it will hold the pressure. Don't know 'till ya givvit a go!!

Helicoil kits are available at some auto parts outlets but more likely at a local engineering supplies shop. Any machine shops near you? - they will have them.

The helicoil is a new thread that you wind into the hole. You have to drill it out oversize and then put the new thread in with a tool supplied with the kit. All instructions are supplied. Just be sure to take your sample stud with you so the correct thread can be sourced. It is likely to be metric.

[The MaDDeSTMaN]

Originally Posted by T3man

Mate, try the loctite now you have it but I doubt it will hold the pressure. Don't know 'till ya givvit a go!!

Helicoil kits are available at some auto parts outlets but more likely at a local engineering supplies shop. Any machine shops near you? - they will have them.

The helicoil is a new thread that you wind into the hole. You have to drill it out oversize and then put the new thread in with a tool supplied with the kit. All instructions are supplied. Just be sure to take your sample stud with you so the correct thread can be sourced. It is likely to be metric.

The locktite seems to be holding for now, but I am yet to actually drive the car, I did leave it idling for 1/2 an hour and it didn't leak a drop, but the real test will obviously be when I try driving it around the block.

I only need it to hold until I can get the Helicoil kit, so hopefully it holds until then...

Just thought I'd type a quick update, after driving it around the block a few times (which I'm about to do), I'll post again to tell you all if it held, or if it leaked water everywhere.

Wish me luck

[LuvinmyEB]

Originally Posted by The MaDDeSTMaN

Just thought I'd type a quick update, after driving it around the block a few times (which I'm about to do), I'll post again to tell you all if it held, or if it leaked water everywhere.
Wish me luck

I'd wish you luck but you must still be going around the block an hour and a half later. :

Oh well hope it held for ya.

I'll just go back outside and stare at the MkI. :lookedat:

[svo347]

Originally Posted by LuvinmyEB

Why doesn't the Loctite work?
If it works on planes, bikes, boats and other cars it should fix the problem your having.

Loctite , is usually a thread locking compound, If you have stripped the threads of a bolt hole, theres nothing to apply pressure to the adhering surface, All you'll end up doin is gluing the bolt into the hole.
Sorry

[kiwikid]

dont underestamate the power of locktite...it holds most fire trucks together...
what type did you get....if you got the right one it should work fine....

re-tap the hole with a larger size

this would be your best bet if locktite doesnt work....

hope that lost bolt isnt somewhere it shouldn't, causing havoc....

[LuvinmyEB]

Originally Posted by kiwikid

dont underestamate the power of locktite...it holds most fire trucks together...
what type did you get....if you got the right one it should work fine....


this would be your best bet if locktite doesnt work....

hope that lost bolt isnt somewhere it shouldn't, causing havoc....

I used to use it on lots of bolts that were threaded, it's strong stuff, I never had a problem with it. I read an article where they used it to hold a thermostat in a plane!!

[kiwikid]

as long as you get the good stuff its Unbelievable how strong it is...
we had three people hanging off a four foot stillsens(sp?) to undo some metal pipe work that was held together with it.....
costly crap it is though...

[Timmeh]

I work in aviation and while products are used to hold things in, no way would something be held in purely with loctite. Consider that most components are lock wired in, I'm skeptical about the thermostat story - but there are some dodgy operators out there...

What is it with the 2L Escort water pumps - my RS2000 keeps losing the alternator bracket bolt - that attachs to the water pump. The thing needs replacing anyway, preventative maintenance, so I'll be sorting that one out after that happens.

Good luck with the repair!

Tim

[T3man]

Originally Posted by Timmeh

I work in aviation and while products are used to hold things in, no way would something be held in purely with loctite. Consider that most components are lock wired in, I'm skeptical about the thermostat story - but there are some dodgy operators out there...

What is it with the 2L Escort water pumps - my RS2000 keeps losing the alternator bracket bolt - that attachs to the water pump. The thing needs replacing anyway, preventative maintenance, so I'll be sorting that one out after that happens.

Good luck with the repair!

Tim

Yep, very common. Caused by vibration of the alternator. I fitted an rubber mount for the alternator at this bracket so the vibrations weren't transferred to the water pump bolt. Has been good now for the last 15 years or so ...


EDIT - Ooops, just went to take a pic for you BUT found that I have since done another mod to it that I had forgotton about. Please excuse my memory - it WAS a long time ago. Anyhow what I subsequently have done is make another bracket, curved, and mounted the engine end to the hole in the water pump casting which is below the water pump bolt.

[The MaDDeSTMaN]

Originally Posted by T3man

Yep, very common. Caused by vibration of the alternator. I fitted an rubber mount for the alternator at this bracket so the vibrations weren't transferred to the water pump bolt. Has been good now for the last 15 years or so ...


EDIT - Ooops, just went to take a pic for you BUT found that I have since done another mod to it that I had forgotton about. Please excuse my memory - it WAS a long time ago. Anyhow what I subsequently have done is make another bracket, curved, and mounted the engine end to the hole in the water pump casting which is below the water pump bolt.

Ahh, good idea! The locktite is holding for now, it leaks a little water still, but only about 200ml per hour of the engine running, so it'll do until I can get it fixed properly. In the mean time, I can just keep topping up the radiator before I start it up. But when I do fix it properly with the helicoil kit, I'll also modify it so the vibrations shouldn't cause any more issues.