Welcome to the Australian Ford Forums forum.

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and inserts advertising. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members, respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features without post based advertising banners. Registration is simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.

Please Note: All new registrations go through a manual approval queue to keep spammers out. This is checked twice each day so there will be a delay before your registration is activated.

Go Back   Australian Ford Forums > Ford Australia Vehicles > Small and Mid Sized Cars > Cougar and Probe

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 13-07-2016, 07:12 PM   #1
Darren290
Donating Member
Donating Member2
 
Darren290's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Hunter Valley
Posts: 3,301
Default Even Deader Cougar in the driveway

My daughters Cougar has died. She topped the car up at a servo but a little over 10kms down the road the car began running rough and wouldn't rev over 2000 RPM. Today the car is hard to start and won't go much past 1500 RPM. It feels like its starving for fuel. We had the fuel pump replaced in January (low pressure/stuttering) and it went ok. Still stuttered occasionally however. Anyone had a similar problem? Whats the best way to test the pump or even the fuel?
Darren290 is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
Old 13-07-2016, 07:56 PM   #2
GTLEGEND
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 3,529
Technical Contributor: For members who share their technical expertise. - Issue reason: The quality of information he provides is in depth and highly valued by those posting questions. Valued Contributor: For members whose non technical contributions are worthy of recognition. - Issue reason: Every advice post I visit where OP are seeking advice for their new vehicle, he is there and adds valuable support and advice for rectifying the problem. Really is a Legend. 
Default Re: Even Deader Cougar in the driveway

Quote:
Originally Posted by superpursuit05 View Post
My daughters Cougar has died. She topped the car up at a servo but a little over 10kms down the road the car began running rough and wouldn't rev over 2000 RPM. Today the car is hard to start and won't go much past 1500 RPM. It feels like its starving for fuel. We had the fuel pump replaced in January (low pressure/stuttering) and it went ok. Still stuttered occasionally however. Anyone had a similar problem? Whats the best way to test the pump or even the fuel?
Sounds like she got a tank of contaminated fuel (usually with water especially after all the rain we have had). You need to get a fuel sample either from the fuel line at the engine, pump or filter.

Its just too much of a co-incidence that the fault happened after she fuelled up!
GTLEGEND is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
2 users like this post:
Old 13-07-2016, 08:09 PM   #3
Darren290
Donating Member
Donating Member2
 
Darren290's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Hunter Valley
Posts: 3,301
Default Re: Even Deader Cougar in the driveway

Thanks again GTLEGEND!!
Thats what I thought but she said there was no problem till she got near home, 10kms after she fuelled up.
Her solution was to the problem was to buy another car.....She wants nothing more to do with the Cougar. So it looks like I've inherited a Cougar!!!
It also needed the spark plugs and leads changed but she hadn't got that far. I was thinking of doing the coil pack if it was only the fuel to gt it running properly..
Darren290 is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
Old 13-07-2016, 09:14 PM   #4
GTLEGEND
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 3,529
Technical Contributor: For members who share their technical expertise. - Issue reason: The quality of information he provides is in depth and highly valued by those posting questions. Valued Contributor: For members whose non technical contributions are worthy of recognition. - Issue reason: Every advice post I visit where OP are seeking advice for their new vehicle, he is there and adds valuable support and advice for rectifying the problem. Really is a Legend. 
Default Re: Even Deader Cougar in the driveway

Quote:
Originally Posted by superpursuit05 View Post
Thanks again GTLEGEND!!
Thats what I thought but she said there was no problem till she got near home, 10kms after she fuelled up.
Her solution was to the problem was to buy another car.....She wants nothing more to do with the Cougar. So it looks like I've inherited a Cougar!!!
It also needed the spark plugs and leads changed but she hadn't got that far. I was thinking of doing the coil pack if it was only the fuel to gt it running properly..
You would still have had good fuel in the lines, filter etc and about 10kms is about right to get through what should have been the last of the good fuel until the dodgy fuel cam through. Get a sample in a clear bottle and let it sit for a few hours until the water separates from the fuel.
GTLEGEND is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
2 users like this post:
Old 14-07-2016, 07:20 AM   #5
REDDYZ
Regular Member
 
REDDYZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 473
Default Re: Even Deader Cougar in the driveway

Bad fuel could be a possibility but personally I don't think that would be the issue considering there were fuel pump issues in the past. Fuel pump issues is a known issue with many Cougars that non one exactly knows what the cause is. However in other cases it is a problem only when the fuel drops below 1/4 level. Replacing fuel pump didn't resolve the issue. Some were lucky but not many. Before you consider any expensive/complicated options I would suggest to check all the usual suspects first. Vacuum leak is a common problem with cougars. Look around the engine for any loose vacuum hoses. Check IACV is working as it should. Open while foot off throttle and closed otherwise. Fuel pressure regulator is another one to check. Some Cougars were equipped with bigger fuel regulators that has big diaphragm and a vacuum hose going in. This can be located next to IACV. These were the models that had fuel pump issues as far I have seen.

I need to tell you getting fuel out of Cougar is a nightmare. Dropping tank is another one. Many have cut open the floor under rear passenger seat to access tank or pump. Am sure whoever has replaced the pump in the past would know this better. Just open the rear seats and see if the floor is already cut open. If so, its easy to access the pump or to get sample or to empty the tank. One option is to hotwire the pump to get fuel out. I don't recommend this unless you know what you are doing. See how you go.
__________________
00' MTX 2.5L (Limited edition Eibach Cougar); Dark Green Tourmaline; Lowered with Eibach tuned suspension from factory; SVT UIM, LIM & Throttle body; Supercat 2.5" dual exhaust with twin pipe quad outlets; Custom headers; Custom coloured instrument cluster; K&N Apollo CAI kit; Calibre oil catch can.
REDDYZ is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
This user likes this post:
Old 14-07-2016, 09:12 AM   #6
Darren290
Donating Member
Donating Member2
 
Darren290's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Hunter Valley
Posts: 3,301
Default Re: Even Deader Cougar in the driveway

I'll try later today to switch it on to see if the fuel pump primes/builds pressure. If I can't hear anything I'll take it back to where she got it repaired since the original repairs were and still are covered under their warranty.
I'll test the fuel but no-one else had problems according to the servo.
Darren290 is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
Old 15-07-2016, 06:07 PM   #7
Darren290
Donating Member
Donating Member2
 
Darren290's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Hunter Valley
Posts: 3,301
Default Re: Even Deader Cougar in the driveway

Tried to start it today, it ran for 10 seconds then stopped. Refused to run though sounded as though it would nearly fire. Checked all the vacuum line and found one split. Fixed it but no luck. Tried again and then removed the spark plugs which were 'wet'. I'm guessing this might be a spark issue?
Tried to siphon fuel out of it but the hose wouldn't get into the bottom of the filler tube.
Darren290 is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
Old 15-07-2016, 06:31 PM   #8
REDDYZ
Regular Member
 
REDDYZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 473
Default Re: Even Deader Cougar in the driveway

There's a flap at the bottom of the filler neck that blocks anything other than liquid going through the filler hose. I had tried all possible things to siphon through the filler with no luck. The filler tube has U turn bend at one point which makes it even harder. Next time the engine stops take fuel pump fuse off and spark plugs off (one at a time) and see if there's a spark when you crank the engine.
__________________
00' MTX 2.5L (Limited edition Eibach Cougar); Dark Green Tourmaline; Lowered with Eibach tuned suspension from factory; SVT UIM, LIM & Throttle body; Supercat 2.5" dual exhaust with twin pipe quad outlets; Custom headers; Custom coloured instrument cluster; K&N Apollo CAI kit; Calibre oil catch can.
REDDYZ is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
This user likes this post:
Old 15-07-2016, 06:32 PM   #9
REDDYZ
Regular Member
 
REDDYZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 473
Default Re: Even Deader Cougar in the driveway

There are 2 flaps altogether one at the neck and one at the end of the filler tube.
__________________
00' MTX 2.5L (Limited edition Eibach Cougar); Dark Green Tourmaline; Lowered with Eibach tuned suspension from factory; SVT UIM, LIM & Throttle body; Supercat 2.5" dual exhaust with twin pipe quad outlets; Custom headers; Custom coloured instrument cluster; K&N Apollo CAI kit; Calibre oil catch can.
REDDYZ is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
This user likes this post:
Old 15-07-2016, 10:52 PM   #10
Darren290
Donating Member
Donating Member2
 
Darren290's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Hunter Valley
Posts: 3,301
Default Re: Even Deader Cougar in the driveway

Just been told that when they looked underneath it was glowing red and smoking near the exhaust on the right side. Up on a jack tomorrow to investigate.
Darren290 is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
Old 16-07-2016, 06:43 AM   #11
REDDYZ
Regular Member
 
REDDYZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 473
Default Re: Even Deader Cougar in the driveway

Looks like no spark and exhaust is flooded with fuel which is when this happens because of catalytic converter. There are 3 catalytic converters on cougar. Two pre-cats where exhaust manifold becomes single pipe (near engine block) which I think are glowing red because of unburnt fuel and the other is the main big one in the middle of the exhaust line.
__________________
00' MTX 2.5L (Limited edition Eibach Cougar); Dark Green Tourmaline; Lowered with Eibach tuned suspension from factory; SVT UIM, LIM & Throttle body; Supercat 2.5" dual exhaust with twin pipe quad outlets; Custom headers; Custom coloured instrument cluster; K&N Apollo CAI kit; Calibre oil catch can.
REDDYZ is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
This user likes this post:
Old 16-07-2016, 06:45 AM   #12
REDDYZ
Regular Member
 
REDDYZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 473
Default Re: Even Deader Cougar in the driveway

Got to be careful not to burn out the cats.
__________________
00' MTX 2.5L (Limited edition Eibach Cougar); Dark Green Tourmaline; Lowered with Eibach tuned suspension from factory; SVT UIM, LIM & Throttle body; Supercat 2.5" dual exhaust with twin pipe quad outlets; Custom headers; Custom coloured instrument cluster; K&N Apollo CAI kit; Calibre oil catch can.
REDDYZ is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
This user likes this post:
Old 16-07-2016, 09:10 AM   #13
Darren290
Donating Member
Donating Member2
 
Darren290's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Hunter Valley
Posts: 3,301
Default Re: Even Deader Cougar in the driveway

He reckons the exhaust wasnt glowing but something near it. I doubt he really knows. Either way I'll have a look tomorrow to see whats been toasted under there.
Darren290 is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
Old 16-07-2016, 04:20 PM   #14
Darren290
Donating Member
Donating Member2
 
Darren290's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Hunter Valley
Posts: 3,301
Default Re: Even Deader Cougar in the driveway

Nothing toasted so I'll drop the exhaust tomorrow and have a look.
Darren290 is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
Old 18-07-2016, 10:57 AM   #15
thearrow
Regular Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 455
Default Re: Even Deader Cougar in the driveway

I read somewhere a way to drain the fuel was to disconnect the fuel line from the motor and let the fuel pump MT the tank.

It was a backyard fix from the US site.
__________________
Owning a Cougar is like owning a Super Model

Good to own but "High Maintenance"

2000 Model Eibach Cougar (Auto) - Now dead & buried
thearrow is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
This user likes this post:
Old 28-07-2016, 05:20 PM   #16
Darren290
Donating Member
Donating Member2
 
Darren290's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Hunter Valley
Posts: 3,301
Default Re: Even Deader Cougar in the driveway

Quote:
Originally Posted by thearrow View Post
I read somewhere a way to drain the fuel was to disconnect the fuel line from the motor and let the fuel pump MT the tank.

It was a backyard fix from the US site.
There's a valve (same as a tyre valve) on the fuel line near the manifold. You remove the valve and turn the ignition on but you have to bridge the relay so the pump runs continuously otherwise it'll only deposit whats under pressure to the fuel rail. I'm not game to bridge the relay as I'm not confident which terminal does what. Apparently it can do some damage if its not done right.
Not so sure it's the fuel either. We took out about two litres using the above method and let it sit overnight. Didn't see anything unusual in the bottom of the bottle. From what I've found so far if they almost run under full throttle (like this one) the coil pack is ****** or the crank angle sensor is ******. Ordered both this week so when they arrive I'll replace both and see what happens. We were going to replace the coil pack anyway to chase a small miss it had on take off. Also found a vacuum connection on the manifold badly split as well.
Darren290 is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
Old 29-07-2016, 11:14 AM   #17
thearrow
Regular Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 455
Default Re: Even Deader Cougar in the driveway

I had a vacuum leak one day whilst crossing the Sydney Harbour Bridge northbound the car would almost but not quite stall on a hill but would run perfectly on the flat/downhill managed to get it back to my mechanic.

The problem was a plastic hose connector had cracked and when it was going up hill it opened up the leak but on the flat or down hill it closed up again talk about a pain in the derriere.
__________________
Owning a Cougar is like owning a Super Model

Good to own but "High Maintenance"

2000 Model Eibach Cougar (Auto) - Now dead & buried
thearrow is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
This user likes this post:
Old 29-07-2016, 06:58 PM   #18
Darren290
Donating Member
Donating Member2
 
Darren290's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Hunter Valley
Posts: 3,301
Default Re: Even Deader Cougar in the driveway

Since we had planned to anyway today we replaced the coil pack, plugs and crank angle sensor. The plugs were old garbage with gaps up over 2mm wide with cracked and burnt ceramics. The crank angle sensor had a large crack in it. We then found a small diameter vacuum line with a broken end under the coil pack. Spent a fair while trying to find where it came from and where it was supposed to go but no luck. It fired briefly for about 5 seconds then returned to nearly firing with full throttle. Draining the fuel tank is next and its going to be a pita. Seems the quickest way is to remove the fuel pump and do it manually.
Darren290 is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
Old 29-07-2016, 10:58 PM   #19
REDDYZ
Regular Member
 
REDDYZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 473
Default Re: Even Deader Cougar in the driveway

Send a pic of the vacuum hose I can tell where it would go..
__________________
00' MTX 2.5L (Limited edition Eibach Cougar); Dark Green Tourmaline; Lowered with Eibach tuned suspension from factory; SVT UIM, LIM & Throttle body; Supercat 2.5" dual exhaust with twin pipe quad outlets; Custom headers; Custom coloured instrument cluster; K&N Apollo CAI kit; Calibre oil catch can.
REDDYZ is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
This user likes this post:
Old 30-07-2016, 11:18 AM   #20
Darren290
Donating Member
Donating Member2
 
Darren290's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Hunter Valley
Posts: 3,301
Default Re: Even Deader Cougar in the driveway

The vacuum leads in peril.

Last edited by Darren290; 01-10-2016 at 10:17 AM.
Darren290 is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
Old 30-07-2016, 12:15 PM   #21
Darren290
Donating Member
Donating Member2
 
Darren290's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Hunter Valley
Posts: 3,301
Default Re: Even Deader Cougar in the driveway

Also found a large white plug on the right side of the fuel tank. Is it a screw out plug or some type of plug that once removed its permanent and we'll need a new tank? I thought it might be an easier solution to draining the tank. Can't upload a pic.
Darren290 is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
Old 30-07-2016, 04:49 PM   #22
aussiblue
FG XR6 Ute & Sedan
Donating Member3
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Bibra Lake WA
Posts: 12,074
Technical Contributor: For members who share their technical expertise. - Issue reason: Has been floating around the oze tech section for a long time and is always there to give advice when people have an issue. 
Default Re: Even Deader Cougar in the driveway

This might help locate the vacuum hose correctly http://www.newcougar.org/forums/2-5l...e-diagram.html as may this http://www.newcougar.org/gallery/fil...l-vacuum01.png
__________________
regards Blue

Last edited by aussiblue; 30-07-2016 at 04:57 PM.
aussiblue is online now   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
This user likes this post:
Old 30-07-2016, 05:08 PM   #23
REDDYZ
Regular Member
 
REDDYZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 473
Default Re: Even Deader Cougar in the driveway

The one from first two pics connects to a big think plastic hose that goes into intake manifold on the top near throttle body. See pic below:






Third one is from rocker cover that goes into flexi rubber air intake hose between the airfilter box and throttle body.



Mine looks different to yours as its from an SVT.
__________________
00' MTX 2.5L (Limited edition Eibach Cougar); Dark Green Tourmaline; Lowered with Eibach tuned suspension from factory; SVT UIM, LIM & Throttle body; Supercat 2.5" dual exhaust with twin pipe quad outlets; Custom headers; Custom coloured instrument cluster; K&N Apollo CAI kit; Calibre oil catch can.
REDDYZ is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
This user likes this post:
Old 30-07-2016, 05:15 PM   #24
REDDYZ
Regular Member
 
REDDYZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 473
Default Re: Even Deader Cougar in the driveway

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daz290 View Post
Also found a large white plug on the right side of the fuel tank. Is it a screw out plug or some type of plug that once removed its permanent and we'll need a new tank? I thought it might be an easier solution to draining the tank. Can't upload a pic.
I know the plug you are talking about. Its kind of hard to access being on side right next to the side rail. Not sure what's the purpose of it. When I had to empty fuel to drop the tank (to replace fuel filler neck seal which was a nightmare ), I didn't choose to undo it. If it is one of use plug then you will find it hard to find a replacement. If you do choose to undo it be mindful of the fuel pressure and put it back accordingly. Cheers.
__________________
00' MTX 2.5L (Limited edition Eibach Cougar); Dark Green Tourmaline; Lowered with Eibach tuned suspension from factory; SVT UIM, LIM & Throttle body; Supercat 2.5" dual exhaust with twin pipe quad outlets; Custom headers; Custom coloured instrument cluster; K&N Apollo CAI kit; Calibre oil catch can.
REDDYZ is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
This user likes this post:
Old 30-07-2016, 09:27 PM   #25
Darren290
Donating Member
Donating Member2
 
Darren290's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Hunter Valley
Posts: 3,301
Default Re: Even Deader Cougar in the driveway

Quote:
Originally Posted by aussiblue View Post
Thanks aussiblue!
Darren290 is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
Old 30-07-2016, 09:30 PM   #26
Darren290
Donating Member
Donating Member2
 
Darren290's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Hunter Valley
Posts: 3,301
Default Re: Even Deader Cougar in the driveway

Quote:
Originally Posted by REDDYZ View Post
The one from first two pics connects to a big think plastic hose that goes into intake manifold on the top near throttle body. See pic below:

image


image

Third one is from rocker cover that goes into flexi rubber air intake hose between the airfilter box and throttle body.

image

Mine looks different to yours as its from an SVT.
Thanks REDDYZ!. Those pics are handy. Wouldn't of looked under that hose.
Fuel tank plug is one of those will or won't I dilemma's. I'll do a bit more research and try and find it's purpose.
Darren290 is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +11. The time now is 02:27 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Other than what is legally copyrighted by the respective owners, this site is copyright www.fordforums.com.au
Positive SSL