Vfacts april 2022 - Page 3

Franco Cozzo · 09-05-2022, 02:00 PM

I'm not convinced on CVT, but I guess thats pretty obvious

jpd80 · 09-05-2022, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

I'm not convinced on CVT, but I guess thats pretty obvious

The one exception I can think of is the E-CVT in the Ford FWD based hybrids, it’s basically a modified Auto casing that uses the engine and two electric motors to balance ICE to electric drive and another motor that turns to change the gear ratio.

BENT_8 · 09-05-2022, 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vesper Martini

I've only driven a couple of CVTs
I a pathfinder it was horrid, kept in high revs all the time its like the Vehicle is too heavy for it.

In a Corolla, it was perfect, kept the little car at low revs so used little fuel and was quiet so really didn't notice the one gear feeling.

I think a lot of anti CVT stems from people who want a Manual anyway.
but.. Manuals are disappearing, new Fords have 10 speeds so will feel like a CVT anyway as a good auto you wont feel any shift

or you could end up drive an EV with no gear changes anyway..

Similar experiences to you, we had a 2013 Outlander with the 2.0l and CVT, horrible bloody thing that required you to rev the ring out of it to go anywhere even with the lightest loads.
Took it to Mitsubishi to enquire as to whether it could be recalibrated as I wasnt sure if it was an adaptive system that was still holding gears from learned behavior, got told no, it is what it is, we soon gave the bloody thing to my Wifes parents as we hated it, that was 4 and a half years ago and they still have it and its still going strong with 170k's on the clock.

Fast forward to late 2020 and my Wife bought a current model ASX with same driveline, completely different car with less weight to shift and rarely saw it revving hard for general use.

Had a Corolla hire car with the CVT, same thing, drove well, probably better than the ASX again.
I think the CVT has a place but only in light weight applications.

**DFB FGXR6** · 09-05-2022, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BENT_8

Similar experiences to you, we had a 2013 Outlander with the 2.0l and CVT, horrible bloody thing that required you to rev the ring out of it to go anywhere even with the lightest loads.
Took it to Mitsubishi to enquire as to whether it could be recalibrated as I wasnt sure if it was an adaptive system that was still holding gears from learned behavior, got told no, it is what it is, we soon gave the bloody thing to my Wifes parents as we hated it, that was 4 and a half years ago and they still have it and its still going strong with 170k's on the clock.

Fast forward to late 2020 and my Wife bought a current model ASX with same driveline, completely different car with less weight to shift and rarely saw it revving hard for general use.

Had a Corolla hire car with the CVT, same thing, drove well, probably better than the ASX again.
I think the CVT has a place but only in light weight applications.

I have driven a couple of Corolla's and Subaru's with CVT's. For what sort of car they are and the sort of driving then do, they were fine.

The best case scenario for a CVT is in sedate cruising or city driving. In such situations, you are using light throttle pressure and the CVT does its thing to keep the revs low. They are perfectly suited to that sort of driving and that sort of driver.

Move beyond those parameters, and CVT's are horrible. The percentage of drivers who would be concerned about unpleasant constant high revs under heavy throttle applications would be in the single figures though on cars like the Corolla, Camry or ASX. In a performance car like the Subaru WRX, they really let the side down.

hackney · 10-05-2022, 07:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpd80

The one exception I can think of is the E-CVT in the Ford FWD based hybrids, it’s basically a modified Auto casing that uses the engine and two electric motors to balance ICE to electric drive and another motor that turns to change the gear ratio.

Honda has a E CVT, they are not a ‘traditional’ CVT in that they do not have the belt & pulley system.Instead it has a lock up clutch(pack) which connects to the trans @ speeds over 80kph or when sudden acceleration is required.It is only a one speed gearbox & holds the revs until the throttle is released.

Vesper Martini · 10-05-2022, 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kypez

Same experience in that I felt the car was just revving high and wasn't fun. In theory, it should be more fuel efficient with infinite number of gears so to speak but it felt weird coming from traditional Autos. Supposed to keep the car in its sweet spot longer in theory. Also, when you mash the pedal, it takes longer for the band to get to the right point/ratio.

The 10 speed still gives you those kickdowns that people have come to love. I do agree they feel a bit CVT hunting for the right ratio and revs all over the shop). I personally hate All Automatics (I'm one of those who just love Manuals). EVs are the only "automatics" that I like that aren't really automatics.

You Cannot get more automatic than a straight drive EV no different than a golf cart IMO

Vesper Martini · 10-05-2022, 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BENT_8

Similar experiences to you, we had a 2013 Outlander with the 2.0l and CVT, horrible bloody thing that required you to rev the ring out of it to go anywhere even with the lightest loads.
Took it to Mitsubishi to enquire as to whether it could be recalibrated as I wasnt sure if it was an adaptive system that was still holding gears from learned behavior, got told no, it is what it is, we soon gave the bloody thing to my Wifes parents as we hated it, that was 4 and a half years ago and they still have it and its still going strong with 170k's on the clock.

Fast forward to late 2020 and my Wife bought a current model ASX with same driveline, completely different car with less weight to shift and rarely saw it revving hard for general use.

Had a Corolla hire car with the CVT, same thing, drove well, probably better than the ASX again.
I think the CVT has a place but only in light weight applications.

I forgot I recently drove an ASX too, not for long but really wasn't that noticeable being a CVT I suppose that's good? the Corolla works great, Toyotas biggest seller I guess they would get it right.

noting both are smallish cars

Vesper Martini · 10-05-2022, 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

I have driven a couple of Corolla's and Subaru's with CVT's. For what sort of car they are and the sort of driving then do, they were fine.

The best case scenario for a CVT is in sedate cruising or city driving. In such situations, you are using light throttle pressure and the CVT does its thing to keep the revs low. They are perfectly suited to that sort of driving and that sort of driver.

Move beyond those parameters, and CVT's are horrible. The percentage of drivers who would be concerned about unpleasant constant high revs under heavy throttle applications would be in the single figures though on cars like the Corolla, Camry or ASX. In a performance car like the Subaru WRX, they really let the side down.

they put a CVT in a WRX! you see that's where it all goes wrong..

I agree with your assessment above

**kypez** · 10-05-2022, 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vesper Martini

You Cannot get more automatic than a straight drive EV no different than a golf cart IMO

Automatic means to change gears automatically. Manual, you change gears manually. When there are no gears, it can't be an automatic anymore. If anything, it's a single speed clutchless manual cause you do shift it once and once alone.

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Vesper Martini · 10-05-2022, 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kypez

Automatic means to change gears automatically. Manual, you change gears manually. When there are no gears, it can't be an automatic anymore. If anything, it's a single speed clutchless manual cause you do shift it once and once alone.

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Thanks for the lesson.... my comment still stands

**kypez** · 10-05-2022, 10:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vesper Martini

Thanks for the lesson.... my comment still stands

I don't think it ever did. But we can agree to disagree. Lighten up, it's just a bit of fun. I even put a smiley to say it's just funny.

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Vesper Martini · 10-05-2022, 10:52 AM

LOL you Can't take a joke, and had to send me some sort of lesson.

But given your response I suggest you look up the definition of Automatic in the dictionary.

(of a device or process) working by itself with little or no direct human control.
done or occurring spontaneously, without conscious thought or attention.

**kypez** · 10-05-2022, 10:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vesper Martini

LOL you Can't take a joke, and had to send me some sort of lesson.

But given your response I suggest you look up the definition of Automatic in the dictionary.

(of a device or process) working by itself with little or no direct human control.
done or occurring spontaneously, without conscious thought or attention.

Sorry you saw that as a lesson. I was laughing whilst writing it.

Anyway, I did do what you suggested... and dictionary.com agrees with my take as does most. But you are right wrt the Taycan. Only EV with an Automatic (2 speed).

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Vesper Martini · 10-05-2022, 11:20 AM

I see you googled "Automatic Transmission"

would you like a bigger shovel

I'm still laugh about this

I personally hate All Automatics (I'm one of those who just love Manuals). EVs are the only "automatics" that I like that aren't really automatics.