Australia housing bubble - Page 22

BENT_8 · 15-06-2018, 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FairmontGS

so...

image

Yeah. That's pretty much what I thought you'd be able to offer...

Lol, a bunch of random people on a car forum cant solve one of Australias biggest problems so therefore there is no problem, makes complete sense, carry on...

roKWiz · 15-06-2018, 03:48 PM

Here's an idea, why don't we give all the land back to its rightful owners (the indigenous people) and lease the land for our housing.

Certainly seems like a fair system.

Mercury Bullet · 15-06-2018, 04:18 PM

We need a good crash.

There is a false perception in this country that real estate is a safe bet.

It's not.

Housing should be a basic human right. Not the money making exercise which Govco has turned it into.

If you over extended, bad luck.

**FairmontGS** · 15-06-2018, 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b0son

so what?

this isn't a problem for young people to fix. its a policy problem EVERYONE needs to fix, but too many have profited and refuse to see their paper wealth reduce, the pollies especially. we need major CGT and negative gearing reform, but its never going to happen.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BENT_8

Lol, a bunch of random people on a car forum cant solve one of Australias biggest problems so therefore there is no problem, makes complete sense, carry on...

Yeah, see I couldn't get through life like that, seeing problems but not being prepared to think about possible solutions. Seems pointless.

Quote:

Originally Posted by roKWiz

Here's an idea, why don't we give all the land back to its rightful owners (the indigenous people) and lease the land for our housing.

Certainly seems like a fair system.

Why not? At least it's an idea

Anyway, off to an auction to buy another investment property to add to my portfolio that I'm building for the sole purpose of ruining the younger people's dreams

zipping · 15-06-2018, 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b0son

so what?

this isn't a problem for young people to fix. its a policy problem EVERYONE needs to fix, but too many have profited and refuse to see their paper wealth reduce, the pollies especially. we need major CGT and negative gearing reform, but its never going to happen.

You really think that is where the problem lies?

You sure?

Have you seen what a greenfields are going for these days?

LAND prices on Melbourne’s fringes surged in 2017, heaping more pressure on buyers struggling to break into the property market at entry level.

The median lot price in the city’s greenfield market rose 29 per cent to $304,000 last year, the Urban Development Institute of Australia’s State of the Land 2018 report shows.

Just think about it for 2 sces 304k median price to live on the outskirts of melbourne before the house is built.

Something is broken and it has little to do with CGT and negaitvie gearing.

Maka · 15-06-2018, 05:52 PM

So whats driving up demand of Australian property? Theres heaps of factors hey - a overcrowded market, cheap finance, over generous tax breaks, restrictive zoning laws, foreign investment, minimal new land releases, lack of fulltime employment etc.

Feel free to add more reasons, eventually we will see the total reasons why prices of Australian property have unequivocally surged to record levels.

cheers, Maka

b0son · 15-06-2018, 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zipping

You really think that is where the problem lies?

Demand drives up prices, but generous tax concessions fuels developer/investor demand in the first place.

GT0132 · 15-06-2018, 06:50 PM

Desirability of an area which is why a house in Point Piper NSW is worth a lot more than one in Roseberry, TAS

prydey · 15-06-2018, 07:02 PM

I wonder how many houses there are around that are unoccupied?

Serious question.

danzvtil · 15-06-2018, 07:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

I wonder how many houses there are around that are unoccupied?

Serious question.

How does that affect the strugglers trying to get a foot in the door?

**FairmontGS** · 15-06-2018, 07:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

I wonder how many houses there are around that are unoccupied?

Serious question.

Good question.

https://www.smh.com.au/politics/fede...17-gxcpiw.html

But the measure may be flawed

https://www.domain.com.au/news/the-r...170726-gxhy8q/

prydey · 15-06-2018, 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by danzvtil

How does that affect the strugglers trying to get a foot in the door?

It doesn't directly but I'm not a fan of people owning more than one house. I have no problem with people having a holiday home or similar, that gets used, but to me anything else is just greed.

If everyone only owned the house they needed to live in, supply would outstrip demand by some margin which would bring prices down.

I admit that is a very simplistic view and a bit idealistic but the point remains.

**FTE217** · 15-06-2018, 08:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b0son

Demand drives up prices, but generous tax concessions fuels developer/investor demand in the first place.

Gov Fed and State could control this better But lets not forget the buck they are making in the first place, why do they need the buck ? because as the decades have passed they have got more useless at running their business's for the people and never keep up with the times but make change on the run, next the point about Developers, true the big have got bigger and more control but without them like any large Industry thriving they employ how many who pay mortgages or make a family life regardless.
So what happens to the portion employed IF things are slowed down, increase the tax's etc, employers start redundancies.
Its a viscous circle BUT I agree it could be governed farfar better but where do we get 1-2 smart thinking people for THE country for a change instead of bush fire management and social media slander.

Mercury Bullet · 15-06-2018, 08:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zipping

You really think that is where the problem lies?

You sure?

Have you seen what a greenfields are going for these days?

LAND prices on Melbourne’s fringes surged in 2017, heaping more pressure on buyers struggling to break into the property market at entry level.

The median lot price in the city’s greenfield market rose 29 per cent to $304,000 last year, the Urban Development Institute of Australia’s State of the Land 2018 report shows.

Just think about it for 2 sces 304k median price to live on the outskirts of melbourne before the house is built.

Something is broken and it has little to do with CGT and negaitvie gearing.

Green fields are absurdly overpriced, way out of proportion to everything except existing housing.

You've gotta start somewhere.

**FTE217** · 15-06-2018, 08:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

It doesn't directly but I'm not a fan of people owning more than one house. I have no problem with people having a holiday home or similar, that gets used, but to me anything else is just greed.

If everyone only owned the house they needed to live in, supply would outstrip demand by some margin which would bring prices down.

I admit that is a very simplistic view and a bit idealistic but the point remains.

prydey, its a admirable thought but its the western world as you know.
Your train of thought makes me wonder your into F1 for eg, I'm sure you'll say its about the driver abilities/ man machine thing you know and Schumi, Bratt, Pettel and the likes who adorn $250k watch's, own several properties/yachts etcetc...like where are you going.
Heck, even our local supercar boys are living the life that is greed as you describe.
Lets get back on the real topic.

asagaai · 15-06-2018, 09:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

It doesn't directly but I'm not a fan of people owning more than one house. I have no problem with people having a holiday home or similar, that gets used, but to me anything else is just greed.

If everyone only owned the house they needed to live in, supply would outstrip demand by some margin which would bring prices down.

I admit that is a very simplistic view and a bit idealistic but the point remains.

See- this is a bit simplistic.

I agree the young have it harder than I had it- and they will need to think outside the square to succeed. And guess what evolution tells us that there will be humans that adapt and engage with the challenge.

About only 1 house- I have paid off my house. I have 2 daughters and worry about HECS and their lives.

Worried about going on pension and being a greedy ***** living off pension which my Kids have to pay off in future years- that's selfish.

So- I am looking at being self sufficient and not rely upon young to fund my pension, and have used my Super to buy a house as the money in the super fund bank account was returning 1.5%.

Why am I a selfish ***** trying to be self funded in retirement and not being a burden on the young trying to do whatever I can to maximize my ability to not being a burden on the young.

Not a simplistic knee jerk situation this.......

Maka · 15-06-2018, 09:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FTE217

prydey, its a admirable thought but its the western world as you know.
Your train of thought makes me wonder your into F1 for eg, I'm sure you'll say its about the driver abilities/ man machine thing you know and Schumi, Bratt, Pettel and the likes who adorn $250k watch's, own several properties/yachts etcetc...like where are you going.
Heck, even our local supercar boys are living the life that is greed as you describe.
Lets get back on the real topic.

Inflation hits all market sectors by different means but the same outcome eventually happens - highly exorbitant prices causing bubbles, pushing prices up & up unsustainably over the long term causing prices to one day come crashing back down taking most markets with them ie a financial depression/crash.

cheers, Maka

MITCHAY · 15-06-2018, 10:10 PM

It is pretty funny how simple maths evades some people

I'm just glad that I got it done and have been living in my own place for a while (since September) but I'm not so sure I would be where I am today had I not been able to live at home for as long as I did.

My mother went through it all and says it is ****ed for young people these days.

**fordomatic** · 15-06-2018, 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MITCHAY

It is pretty funny how simple maths evades some people

I'm just glad that I got it done and have been living in my own place for a while (since September) but I'm not so sure I would be where I am today had I not been able to live at home for as long as I did.

My mother went through it all and says it is ****ed for young people these days.

I moved out when I was 17, stuff living at home. Sister still living at home with her husband, they just paid off their second house, they are both 27.

I think i stuffed up

Lotte · 15-06-2018, 10:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GT0132

You're right mate. It's way tougher now. I'm 55 now and bought my first place in 1988. There was a property boom that year and everyone was going nuts back then because, for example, a 2 bedroom unit at Bondi that was worth $115,000 in 1987 was selling for $150,000 6 months later. Vendors were pulling out of deals because another buyer would offer $5,000 more the next day. That’s when the anti gazzumping laws were introduced . Having a mortgage of $100,000 at that time was considered high. Rates were around 15% and rising. The average salary was $25,000.

Fast forward 30 years and that same property would sell for around $1.0M today and the average wage in 2018 is $84,000. The property has increased 6.7 times while wages have increased by only 3.3.

From that $84,000 you need to put enough away to save a 20% deposit , or $200,000 . After tax on $84,000 you're left with about $65,000 so even if you spent none of that it would take you 3 years to save the deposit.. Then having saved the deposit you need to sign your life away to borrow $800,000 which is probably not achievable on a $84k income.

Pretty much this. Except to add insult to injury, the average wage currently reflects the top 25% of income earners. They tout the number like it's gold, but average wage is misleading, and is only really useful to compare to median wage to (generally) analyse wealth distribution.

The median (full time) wage is closer to 55k. Which is where 50% of the population earn that or above. So you're more looking at... 6-8 years of saving your entire income for a deposit.

MITCHAY · 15-06-2018, 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fordomatic

I moved out when I was 17, stuff living at home. Sister still living at home with her husband, they just paid off their second house, they are both 27.

I think i stuffed up

I was 30 before I moved out (I could have done way earlier) but apart from the money factor it was not a sweet ride. I paid bills even then for a long time.

It was hard and I am thoroughly enjoying my peace and quiet these days despite all the bills. So many bills.

I actually didn't really understand discretionary spending until I bought my house

pottery beige · 15-06-2018, 11:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MITCHAY

I was 30 before I moved out (I could have done way earlier) but apart from the money factor it was not a sweet ride. I paid bills even then for a long time.

It was hard and I am thoroughly enjoying my peace and quiet these days despite all the bills. So many bills

Its a good feeling and props up bud

Franco Cozzo · 15-06-2018, 11:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MITCHAY

It is pretty funny how simple maths evades some people

I'm just glad that I got it done and have been living in my own place for a while (since September) but I'm not so sure I would be where I am today had I not been able to live at home for as long as I did.

My mother went through it all and says it is ****ed for young people these days.

I'm a wog

My cousins lived with their parents into their 30s until they got into their first houses in Melbourne - why would you rent and pay off someone elses mortgage if you can live at home with the folks?

Thats the way we do it.

Thats the way I'm going to do it

At the rate I'm going I'll probably inherit the parents house first to be honest

.:4:. · 15-06-2018, 11:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MITCHAY

I was 30 before I moved out (I could have done way earlier) but apart from the money factor it was not a sweet ride. I paid bills even then for a long time.

It was hard and I am thoroughly enjoying my peace and quiet these days despite all the bills. So many bills.

I actually didn't really understand discretionary spending until I bought my house

Mate, houses come with expenses which is a given, but in the long term enjoy the piece and quiet and the amount you owe is a constant, well interest rates may change but at least the principal will not. Really unless somehow a lender lent you far more then what you can afford which is highly unlikely with the constant scrutiny the mortgage industry is under, the first few years are the hardest, then with wage increases after a few years it all becomes a lot easier to manage. I bought at 25. That's 6 years ago when the market was just starting to go fully stupid with a family on a mundane pay rate and yeah it sucked. Fast forward to now and I dont have the wife anymore but still have the kid but with wage increases i pay the place on a single income and it's cheaper then renting a run down unit in the area. And it's not even a desirable area to be fair. It's not bad but not desirable. The only decent piece of advise my boss has ever told me is once you get on the carousel of home ownership, you never want to get off. I'm not entirely sure how to enterprit that but I think he meant well.

MITCHAY · 15-06-2018, 11:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

I'm a wog

My cousins lived with their parents into their 30s until they got into their first houses in Melbourne - why would you rent and pay off someone elses mortgage if you can live at home with the folks?

Thats the way we do it.

Thats the way I'm going to do it

At the rate I'm going I'll probably inherit the parents house first to be honest

Yeah so am I

But a lot of my concern was about worrying about mum dealing with the other ******** son and I just said if I keep thinking that way I will be living at home for life. I couldn't keep kneecapping myself. She's a tough girl but I wish she didn't have to be. But at least now she can come here anytime she wants to.

**fordomatic** · 15-06-2018, 11:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MITCHAY

I was 30 before I moved out (I could have done way earlier) but apart from the money factor it was not a sweet ride. I paid bills even then for a long time.

It was hard and I am thoroughly enjoying my peace and quiet these days despite all the bills. So many bills.

I actually didn't really understand discretionary spending until I bought my house

Good stuff mate, you’ve done it and did what you had to do to get it

MITCHAY · 15-06-2018, 11:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fordomatic

Good stuff mate, you’ve done it and did what you had to do to get it

I have had quite a bit of a leg up but no doubt I worked my **** off for it

Franco Cozzo · 16-06-2018, 12:15 AM

https://www.realestate.com.au/proper...rton-128296914

https://www.realestate.com.au/proper...bury-128478066

Both low socioeconomic areas - I was born in and still spend a lot of time in the latter

Amazing the difference in prices, given the latter is twice as far out of the CBD as the first one and the house is a run down hole in a part of that suburb that was affectionately named 'Little Chicago' by its residents for its significant drug problems.

MITCHAY · 16-06-2018, 12:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

https://www.realestate.com.au/proper...rton-128296914

https://www.realestate.com.au/proper...bury-128478066

Both low socioeconomic areas - I was born in and spend a lot of time in the latter

Amazing the difference in prices, given the latter is twice as far out of the CBD as the first one and the house is a run down hole.

Even in the suburb I grew up in my whole life which is not so great, they are still going for $450 to 500k and more for a 3+ beddy.

The median is $700k+ in a population a bit over 400k. How ****ed up is that?

If I'm correct the most expensive after Sydney and Melbourne

davenl5l · 16-06-2018, 06:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by asagaai

See- this is a bit simplistic.

I agree the young have it harder than I had it- and they will need to think outside the square to succeed. And guess what evolution tells us that there will be humans that adapt and engage with the challenge.

About only 1 house- I have paid off my house. I have 2 daughters and worry about HECS and their lives.

Worried about going on pension and being a greedy ***** living off pension which my Kids have to pay off in future years- that's selfish.

So- I am looking at being self sufficient and not rely upon young to fund my pension, and have used my Super to buy a house as the money in the super fund bank account was returning 1.5%.

Why am I a selfish ***** trying to be self funded in retirement and not being a burden on the young trying to do whatever I can to maximize my ability to not being a burden on the young.

Not a simplistic knee jerk situation this.......

Your kids dont pay your pension YOU DO. Every worker in Australia pays 7.5% of gross pay into a pension fund. This is on top of your super. DONT believe the pollies they have redirected this money into general revenue