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Old 22-05-2019, 06:12 PM   #1021
kmav23
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Default Re: That Tesla thread...

https://electrek.co/2019/05/21/apple...a-2013-report/

Apple tried to buy Tesla for more than it’s currently worth a few years ago, report says !


Apple reportedly offered to buy Tesla at around $240 per share back in 2013.

The bid from six years ago is now being reported as Tesla’s share price has dipped under the price Apple was allegedly willing to pay.

Today, Craig Irwin, senior research analyst at Roth Capital Partners, went on CNBC and talked about the bid:

“Around 2013, there was a serious bid from Apple at around $240 a share.”

The analyst didn’t disclose his sources, but he added:

“This is something we did multiple checks on. I have complete confidence that this is accurate. Apple bid for Tesla. I don’t know if it got to a formal paperwork stage, but I know from multiple different sources that this was very credible.”


Irwin argues that Apple could still have interest in purchasing Tesla – especially since Tesla’s valuation has taken a major hit over the past months.

He says that Apple’s Project Titan, which is developing an autonomous electric vehicle, is still ongoing and the tech giant could be interested in using some of Tesla’s EV expertise.

The Cupertino company has already been relying heavily on Tesla’s expertise through poaching. Several senior Tesla engineers and executives have moved to Apple in recent years, most recently Apple hired Tesla’s head of electric powertrains.

We already know that Elon Musk looked into selling Tesla back in 2013, but I am not sure about this $240 per share price that Apple was apparently willing to pay.

In the Elon Musk biography by Ashlee Vance, it was revealed that Musk and Larry Page, the head of Alphabet (Google’s parent company), had a deal for the latter to purchase Tesla:

In the first week of March 2013, Musk reached out to Page, say the two people familiar with the talks. By that point, so many customers were deferring orders that Musk had quietly shut down Tesla’s factory. Considering his straits, Musk drove a hard bargain. He proposed that Google buy Tesla outright — with a healthy premium, the company would have cost about $6 billion at the time — and pony up another $5 billion in capital for factory expansions. He also wanted guarantees that Google wouldn’t break up or shut down his company before it produced a third-generation electric car aimed at the mainstream auto market. He insisted that Page let him run a Google-owned Tesla for eight years, or until it began pumping out such a car. Page accepted the overall proposal and shook on the deal.

It was during a brief difficult time for Tesla to ramp up Model S production and deliver cars to customers, but things turned for the better and Musk reportedly dropped the deal.

At the time, there were rumors of Musk meeting with Apple’s mergers and acquisitions chief Adrian Perica. It’s not hard to believe that if he was looking to make a deal with Google, he also checked if Apple was interested.

Now as to the deal still being relevant today, I am not so sure. Apple might still be interested. They certainly have the cash and Tesla’s valuation has been dropping fast, but I am not so sure Musk would want to get behind a sale.

Ultimately, he is not the only one with a say in this, but he is still the biggest shareholder.

While things haven’t been going great lately, Tesla went back to the market to raise a few billion dollars. If they were interested in selling, I don’t think that would have been their first move.
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Old 22-05-2019, 06:16 PM   #1022
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Default Re: That Tesla thread...

The lower the stock price the greater the chance it will be purchased by Apple or another company so Tesla will survive no matter what as its too valuable.

If Apple purchases it, then it will inject billions into the company and ensure its long term success.

They were willing to pay $240 in 2013 when Tesla was still in its infancy.
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Old 22-05-2019, 11:57 PM   #1023
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Old 23-05-2019, 12:47 AM   #1024
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Default Re: That Tesla thread...

Elon Musk swirling down the tubes, as it appears the last capital raising in April was not enough to stem the bleeding:

https://www.latimes.com/business/aut...521-story.html

Tesla Inc., faced with a slumping stock price and questions about demand for its vehicles, has lowered the U.S. base prices of its two most expensive models.

The Elon Musk-led automaker cut $3,000 from the price of the Model S sedan and $2,000 from the Model X SUV.

Tesla said in a statement that, like other companies, it periodically adjusted prices and available options. The decreases offset price increases from a month ago, when Tesla offered longer battery range and added a new drive system and suspension. The statement didn’t say whether slowing sales had influenced the decision.

The Model S now starts at $71,250, and the X starts at $71,950. Those prices do not include federal and state tax credits.

Several analysts have questioned whether the company can sell enough cars to cover its expenses without dipping into cash reserves. Last week, Musk called for a “hardcore” review of all the company’s expenses to manage cash burn.

Tesla’s stock is under pressure, and in the last two days its shares have wavered below the $200 mark. After dipping Tuesday morning, shares ended the day at $205.08, barely changed from Monday’s closing price. They are down more than 38% so far this year, lopping more than $20 billion off the company’s market value. On Monday, the shares hit their lowest point since late 2016.

On Tuesday, Tesla sustained another blow from Wall Street analysts: Morgan Stanley slashed its worst-case scenario for the share price to just $10 over concern the company had saturated the electric-car market.


“Demand is at the heart of the problem,” analysts led by Adam Jonas said in a note. “Tesla has grown too big relative to near-term demand, putting great strain on the fundamentals.”

Jonas lowered his “bear case” for Tesla shares from a previous estimate of $97 to take into account the risk that the company misses its current sales forecast for China by about half. He maintained his $230 price target.

The price reductions for the Model S and X vehicles are less than 3%. Last week, Tesla raised the price of its top-selling Model 3 by $400, pushing the base price to $35,400. “By any reasonable standard, these small changes are not newsworthy,” the automaker said in a statement.

After handing over just 63,000 cars in the first quarter, Tesla expects to deliver as many as 100,000 cars in the second and four times that for the year. Hitting the full-year target will be a “Herculean task,” Wedbush Securities analyst Dan Ives wrote in a report Sunday, calling the issues plaguing the company a “code red situation.”

Even Ben Kallo, a longtime Tesla bull at Robert W. Baird & Co. who maintains the equivalent of a “buy” rating on the stock, wrote Tuesday that it could take several weeks or months for the negative narrative surrounding the carmaker to shift. He cut his price target to $340 from $400, telling clients that “credibility questions, messaging/communication and significant noise around TSLA have kept incremental buyers out of the market.”

For Tesla to breathe life back into demand, it will have to aggressively expand into China, offer lower-priced sport utility vehicles and supply mobility fleets, Morgan Stanley’s Jonas said. U.S.-China trade tensions and new auto competitors put this strategy at risk, he said.

“We give Tesla credit for tapping into the world’s largest EV market for a number of years” in China, Jonas said. “We strongly suspect a host of national champions to emerge.”

Tesla isn’t alone in battling weaker global markets, including China. Germany’s central bank warned that its nation’s auto industry — one of the key pillars of Europe’s largest economy — is facing more trouble as China’s slowdown deepens.

The slump comes just as incumbent carmakers are spending heavily to develop electric cars.

Tesla said last month that it lost $702.1 million in the first quarter, which was among its worst quarters in two years. Sales tumbled 31% in the period. Musk predicted another loss in the second quarter but said Tesla would be profitable again by the third quarter.

In January, the automaker cut its prices by $2,000 per vehicle, acknowledging that the pending expiration of a $7,500 federal tax credit for its electric cars will hurt sales. The credit is gradually being phased out for Tesla by the end of the year.



Looking on the bright side, Tesla’s escape strategy involves massive sales of an as-yet-undeveloped budget EV in China. But no mention of South Australia – so that’s good.
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Old 23-05-2019, 08:40 AM   #1025
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Default Re: That Tesla thread...

Share price dropped again, currently $192/share. After session trading indicates another bad day tomorrow.

I wonder about the sheeple and their advisors who thought it was a good idea to buy @ $240/share, they’re probably trying their best to minimize their losses. Given the volatility and repeated false promises it would be a brave man to call the bottom of the price cycle. Of course non of this is good news for Tesla sales and every competitor will be highlighting the Tesla dilemma to car buyers.

Short sellers are making an absolute killing.

Maybe $10/share is the correct valuation .i.e worthless.
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Old 23-05-2019, 06:50 PM   #1026
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Default Re: That Tesla thread...

Just remember the stock IPO at $17 9 years ago.

On the bear side they have predicted Tesla would go bankrupt every year for the last 9 years and on the bear side predictions that the stock can go up to $4000.

My prediction is the stock will hover around $200 to $250 for the next few months as value buyers come back in as its such a volatile stock.

You can be sure there are people making lots of money shorting and calling the stock, talking in up one minute then talking it down.

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Old 23-05-2019, 07:03 PM   #1027
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Default Re: That Tesla thread...

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Originally Posted by kmav23 View Post
Just remember the stock IPO at $17 9 years ago.

On the bear side they have predicted Tesla would go bankrupt every year for the last 9 years and on the bear side predictions that the stock can go up to $4000.

My prediction is the stock will hover around $200 to $250 for the next few months as value buyers come back in as its such a volatile stock.

You can be sure there are people making lots of money shorting and calling the stock, talking in up one minute then talking it down.
You couldn’t predict what you will be eating for dinner.

Stock will continue to sink along will any cash reserves with elon running them into the ground. They were supposed to be profitable but all they do is lose money. Shareholders must have realised by now that elon is a snake oil salesmen who’s predictions of profit are nothing but lies. Oh well, when they go belly up im sure elon could get a job as the iraqi communications minister.
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Old 24-05-2019, 11:03 AM   #1028
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Default Re: That Tesla thread...

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Originally Posted by kmav23 View Post
Just remember the stock IPO at $17 9 years ago.

On the bear side they have predicted Tesla would go bankrupt every year for the last 9 years and on the bear side predictions that the stock can go up to $4000.

My prediction is the stock will hover around $200 to $250 for the next few months as value buyers come back in as its such a volatile stock.

You can be sure there are people making lots of money shorting and calling the stock, talking in up one minute then talking it down.
Maybe your a Stock Broker kmav & not a politician
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Old 24-05-2019, 11:07 AM   #1029
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Default Re: That Tesla thread...

I think there is a serious typo in kmav’s post. Outside of perhaps the Mardi Gras or Sleaze Ball, I can’t imagine bears having it both ways.

So - one implied possible outcome must be bull!
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Old 24-05-2019, 11:26 AM   #1030
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that elon is a snake oil salesmen who’s predictions of profit are nothing but lies.
he could be an Australian politician then...
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Old 01-06-2019, 12:57 AM   #1031
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Default Re: That Tesla thread...

TESLA MODEL 3 ORDERS OPEN IN AUSTRALIA

That's right, the Model 3 is finally available for order Down Under. Deliveries are on track for August, and anyone can put their order in right now.

Tesla fans, the wait is over. As of right now you're able to configure and order a Model 3 for delivery in Australia, more than three years after reservations opened.

Reservation holders, some of whom lined up overnight in March 2016 for their place in the queue, will get their cars first, but anyone keen on a Model 3 can place an order as of now.

Deliveries will start in August, with "reservation date, delivery location and configuration options" all playing a role in delivery order.

The line-up will start with the Standard Range Plus, priced from $66,000 before on-road costs with 460km of range on the (more lenient) NEDC test cycle. Top speed is pegged at 225km/h, and the 100km/h sprint takes 5.6 seconds.

That makes the base Model 3 pricier than the top-spec Hyundai Kona Electric Highlander by $1500, although it's $6000 more expensive than the base model. The plug-in Kona has a claimed 450km 'real-world' range figure – for comparison's sake, it'll do 557km on the NEDC test.

Moving to the dual-motor Performance bumps that price to $85,000 before on-roads, boosts claimed range to 560km and slashes the 100km/h sprint to just 3.4 seconds.

A black interior is the only option on either model, and both cars ride on 18-inch aero wheels as standard.

Performance buyers will be able to tick a $6200 box for the 'Performance Upgrade', which brings 20-inch wheels, bigger brakes, a carbon-fibre lip spoiler, lowered suspension, aluminium pedals and 'Track Mode',

Autopilot will be standard across the range, but the 'Full Self-Driving Capability' option will add $7100 to the starting price. Five colours are available: black, silver, blue, white and red. Black is standard, silver and blue are $1400, white is $2100, and red adds $2800 to the sticker.

It allows the car to automatically change lanes on the highway and park hands-free at the moment, but Tesla claims cars with the option will be able to recognise traffic lights and road signs, drive automatically and 'summon' later this year.

As for charging? Over to Tesla:

"To enable Supercharging of Model 3, which will come with a CCS Combo 2 charge port, dual charging cables supporting both CCS Combo 2 and Type 2 charging standards will be installed at Supercharger sites across Australia."
In the USA, the range kicks off with the Standard Range Plus (equivalent to $56k), jumping to the all-wheel drive Long Range (equiv. $70k), and topping out with the dual-motor Performance (equiv. $84.5k).

The order book opening in Australia means the right-hand drive Model 3 will be available in the UK, New Zealand, Japan and Hong Kong.
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Old 01-06-2019, 03:43 PM   #1032
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Default Re: That Tesla thread...

I'm sure the 100 or so they will sell here a year will keep them in business.
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Old 01-06-2019, 05:07 PM   #1033
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Wow base model 1500 bucks dearer than top of line huyundai and has less range .then start optioning it up the the color chart to white (wtf)etc and will be pushing mid 70s plus.those are great pay back figs not if you are going this way to save on running costs
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Old 01-06-2019, 05:40 PM   #1034
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Default Re: That Tesla thread...

This makes the Hyundai look great value for money. Competition is good for consumers. I wonder if Tesla entering their lower priced model might convince Nissan to bring the current gen Leaf over here. Let’s see how sales of both Hyundai and Tesla go.
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Old 01-06-2019, 06:12 PM   #1035
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Wow base model 1500 bucks dearer than top of line huyundai and has less range .then start optioning it up the the color chart to white (wtf)etc and will be pushing mid 70s plus.those are great pay back figs not if you are going this way to save on running costs
Don't know where they got that from. I was quoted $72k for the Kona. The Model 3 is $71k

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Old 01-06-2019, 06:36 PM   #1036
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I dont know was only responding to your mates figures and they must be right .either way if you are buying 1 or the other to save on running costs the numbers just dont add up yet
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Old 01-06-2019, 06:55 PM   #1037
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I dont know was only responding to your mates figures and they must be right .either way if you are buying 1 or the other to save on running costs the numbers just dont add up yet
They do for me as I've shown plenty of times in this thread.

Even with my model S, it'll pay itself off in 8 years compared to my Sprint 6 which would never save me enough running cost to pay itself back. The inflection point between both cars would be just under 3 years.

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Old 01-06-2019, 07:15 PM   #1038
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Take the kona.drive away about 40k petrol.at an avg of 8l/100 at say $1.50/ for an avg 20k a year is about $ 2.5k plus 2 sevices round out to 3.5k a year.so at 32k extral for the electric thats about 10years plus on the retuen to break even not taking into account the interest on the extra finance which would add anothe couple of years.thats not even taking into account the extra time to fill and reduced travelling distance or the cost of charging over that time.thats a lot of years for break even .yes those figs will change if you do more ks but they are on an apples for apples comparison
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Old 01-06-2019, 07:49 PM   #1039
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Take the kona.drive away about 40k petrol.at an avg of 8l/100 at say $1.50/ for an avg 20k a year is about $ 2.5k plus 2 sevices round out to 3.5k a year.so at 32k extral for the electric thats about 10years plus on the retuen to break even not taking into account the interest on the extra finance which would add anothe couple of years.thats not even taking into account the extra time to fill and reduced travelling distance or the cost of charging over that time.thats a lot of years for break even .yes those figs will change if you do more ks but they are on an apples for apples comparison
But I'd not buy either of them. They're slow cars.

My model S to the Sprint.

Both RWD
0-100 4.4 vs 4.6 (what I've run)
0-400m 12.9 vs 13.004 (again, my times)
Both seat 5.
Similar to insure (Tesla is $200 dearer)
27.41 vs 30.87 at the Huntley Hill Climb.

So for me, they're similar cars.

I save just under $12,000 on petrol a year. Throw in no servicing, etc, it works out a lot cheaper to own and run. Within 3 years, I'll be at the same cost between the two. After that, the Tesla will continue to be cheaper to run.

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Old 01-06-2019, 08:04 PM   #1040
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But I'd not buy either of them. They're slow cars.

My model S to the Sprint.

Both RWD
0-100 4.4 vs 4.6 (what I've run)
0-400m 12.9 vs 13.004 (again, my times)
Both seat 5.
Similar to insure (Tesla is $200 dearer)
27.41 vs 30.87 at the Huntley Hill Climb.

So for me, they're similar cars.

I save just under $12,000 on petrol a year. Throw in no servicing, etc, it works out a lot cheaper to own and run. Within 3 years, I'll be at the same cost between the two. After that, the Tesla will continue to be cheaper to run.

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there is no 'non electric' tesla to make the same comparison, and you have to admit, that you are the exception, rather than the rule. Not many average folk would spend $12k a year on fuel.

You have bought the car also for other reasons. the saving is just a bonus I believe.

each person has to make the decision for themselves. people justify upgrading cars for all sorts of reasons. people buy new petrol cars to save money on their old petrol car. The argument never stacks up logically but people tell themselves whatever they have to to justify the purchase. logic rarely comes in to car buying. its emotion.

prius was the same when it came out. a corolla was by far the smarter choice financially, but the prius was a 'statement' car. Electric cars have that element too. For now.
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Old 01-06-2019, 08:19 PM   #1041
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there is no 'non electric' tesla to make the same comparison, and you have to admit, that you are the exception, rather than the rule. Not many average folk would spend $12k a year on fuel.

You have bought the car also for other reasons. the saving is just a bonus I believe.

each person has to make the decision for themselves. people justify upgrading cars for all sorts of reasons. people buy new petrol cars to save money on their old petrol car. The argument never stacks up logically but people tell themselves whatever they have to to justify the purchase. logic rarely comes in to car buying. its emotion.

prius was the same when it came out. a corolla was by far the smarter choice financially, but the prius was a 'statement' car. Electric cars have that element too. For now.
I'll be honest, I bought it cause I liked the technology. I'm not one to care about statements (maybe I'm an exception here as well). The Sprint was bought on emotion but the Tesla was a not a emotional buy; well not the same emotion, more curiosity. Once I discovered the savings, the similar performance, and all the other points I alluded to previously, as you can see from my signature, that the Sprint made no sense in my world and was moved on. The two cars were fulfilling the same task and one was doing it a lot better than the other. The maths didn't lie.

So the emotional purchase of the Sprint was overruled by the logical conclusions.

Might add that I had a BMW i3 for 3 months that I bought before the Tesla. The maths didn't work out and I moved it along. I'd have done the same to the Tesla if it didn't work out. Logic always trumps emotions... (in my world)

No statements, no green peace thoughts, nothing.
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Old 01-06-2019, 09:41 PM   #1042
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Model 3 announced in 2015, unveiled in 2016 and Australian delivered in 2019. Who in their right mind would buy into ancient technology .. oh wait a few dopey people will

Bit like buying a Model S which hasn't been refreshed for yonks and given Tesla's precarious financial situation may not stay in production. Spare me the excuses software patches are not a refresh.
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Old 01-06-2019, 09:42 PM   #1043
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Model 3 announced in 2015, unveiled in 2016 and Australian delivered in 2019. Who in their right mind would buy into ancient technology .. oh wait a few dopey people will



Bit like buying a Model S which hasn't been refreshed for yonks and given Tesla's precarious financial situation may not stay in production. Spare me the excuses software patches are not a refresh.
Same dopey people who bought the FGX I suppose... Given it's roots were 2006...

Difference is that the model S also has been refreshed over the years and will again this year. New motors, batteries, etc. The P85 and P85D did a 0-100 in 4.4/4.2 seconds. The 75, smaller engine was found to be more efficient and could handle more power. So from a 5.4/5.2 car, the 75/75D got a software update and boom, 4.4/4.3 to 100.

This year, they get New motors and batteries.

But forgive me for bringing facts into your opinions...

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Old 01-06-2019, 11:09 PM   #1044
marty351
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I think there is a serious typo in kmav’s post. Outside of perhaps the Mardi Gras or Sleaze Ball, I can’t imagine bears having it both ways.

So - one implied possible outcome must be bull!
kmav's idea of Elon at work...

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Old 02-06-2019, 05:39 AM   #1045
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Same dopey people who bought the FGX I suppose... Given it's roots were 2006...

Difference is that the model S also has been refreshed over the years and will again this year. New motors, batteries, etc. The P85 and P85D did a 0-100 in 4.4/4.2 seconds. The 75, smaller engine was found to be more efficient and could handle more power. So from a 5.4/5.2 car, the 75/75D got a software update and boom, 4.4/4.3 to 100.

This year, they get New motors and batteries.

But forgive me for bringing facts into your opinions...

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You also forgot these earth shattering changes to a platform which was rolled out in 2012.

In 2016, Tesla removed the black nose cone and added a body colored fascia. A HEPA cabin air filtration system was added. Two ash wood interior options were added.

It is simple, Tesla’s doesn’t have the resources to maintain multiple lines of product, it is somewhat focused on the Model 3 and trying to stay in business. As a result its premium model the Model S has been neglected.

But the big question, did you get the ash wood interior?
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Old 02-06-2019, 10:42 AM   #1046
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You also forgot these earth shattering changes to a platform which was rolled out in 2012.



In 2016, Tesla removed the black nose cone and added a body colored fascia. A HEPA cabin air filtration system was added. Two ash wood interior options were added.



It is simple, Tesla’s doesn’t have the resources to maintain multiple lines of product, it is somewhat focused on the Model 3 and trying to stay in business. As a result its premium model the Model S has been neglected.



But the big question, did you get the ash wood interior?
You've just shown how little you know about the cars with that comment. It makes you look ignorant.

They added air suspension (with GPS memory so if you raise it at a location, the car remembers it and raises it there every time so you don't have to remember).

Increased from AP1 to AP2 and then to AP2.5. Big improvements to the system and addition of many more cameras.

Changed the entire software on the cars (and even retrofitted it to older cars. It's similar to if Ford retrofitted sync 2 to all their previous falcons/FG series; yeah, no chance).

The motors were changed as were the battery packs...

And I could go on to the finer details of the upgrades but if you really were interested, you'd have known of all these basic upgrades.

Oh and I got the carbon fibre interior...

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Old 03-06-2019, 10:47 AM   #1047
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https://eftm.com/2019/06/victorian-p...to-fleet-61141

Victorian Police add Tesla Model X to fleet

ByChris BowenPosted on June 3, 2019

Since the end of local manufacturing Police across the country have been looking for suitable replacements for Holden Commodore and Ford Falcon pursuit cars. So far, the Kia Stinger, Chrysler SRT and BMW 530d have made the cut. But Victoria Police has thrown us a curve ball with news an all-electric Tesla Model X will enter into full operational duties, including as a highway patrol car as of today.

The Model X is a one-off at this stage and will help Victorian cops get their heads around complexities such as working with Tesla’s engineers, emergency equipment manufacturers, the department’s vehicle installation contractor and Victoria Police’s IT and communications technicians.

The ultimate plan is to integrate police software into the vehicle’s on-board system, Kia is already trailing this with its Stinger in conjunction with Fujitsu.


Victorian Road Policing Command Assistant Commissioner Stephen Leane said: “This vehicle is unlike any other Victoria Police has ever had in its fleet and could well be the future of road policing in this state, country and the world,”

“Our Highway Patrol cars are equipped with cutting edge technology and this car gives us the opportunity to investigate having these technologies in a fully integrated in-car system which has the potential of streamlining the road policing effort.

“There is also a great environmental benefit to electric vehicles and considering our State Highway Patrol vehicles travel thousands of kilometres on the road per year, we should always be looking at ways we can lessen our impact on the environment.”

The Model X will be the fastest car on any Australian police fleet. The Model X can shoot to 100km/h in just 4.9 seconds. There’s no word on just how much the Model X cost the Victorian force, hopefully they recieved a discount given the Model X kicks off at $116,000
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Old 03-06-2019, 11:35 AM   #1048
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The Model X is a one-off at this stage and will help Victorian cops get their heads around complexities such as working with Tesla’s engineers, emergency equipment manufacturers, the department’s vehicle installation contractor and Victoria Police’s IT and communications technicians

I can't see this experiment progressing any further.

If the popo were really serious, they would order a few more and evaluate them until they break.
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Old 03-06-2019, 12:45 PM   #1049
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Don't know where they got that from. I was quoted $72k for the Kona. The Model 3 is $71k

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apple with apples IONIQ is $50,053
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Old 03-06-2019, 12:49 PM   #1050
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apple with apples IONIQ is $50,053
Not really. The range for the IONIQ is far less. Model 3 range is double even for the short range version.

230kms vs 460kms.

That is not a like for like comparison.
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