‘One Ford’ or not?

R-Design · 27-04-2009, 06:04 PM

http://www.goauto.com.au/mellor/mell...2575A5001BA035

‘One Ford’ design philosophy to apply globally, except for the US

By MARTON PETTENDY 27 April 2009

FORD says its newly enacted One Ford approach to global model designs will apply to all future models – but not the Blue Oval’s pick-up and SUV models sold in North America.

“We’ve developed a strategy that One Ford is for products which are sold all around the world,” said Ford of Europe executive design director Martin Smith at last week’s Shanghai motor show.

“(But) There’s only one continent, apart from South America, that does products only for its continent and that is North America. There are many products that are only sold in North America.

“In Australia, you have a situation where the Falcon has to sit with a lot of products coming from Europe, but in North America there is currently no product coming in from Europe.

“Starting with the Fiesta, that’s a specific small-car market and the customers in North America are targeted in the same way as they are in the rest of the world: younger designer-wear people that want a really stylish small car. That’s never really existed in North America before, that requirement.

Left: Ford Falcon G6.

“(But) What we’ve said is that for the products in North America which are only sold in North America in a North American environment are very specific.

“For example, an F150 truck wouldn’t sell anywhere else in the world, a Mustang sells in isolated numbers around the world and the Explorer, for example … cars like this are designed for a specific type of customer only in America.

“These are what we call the icons of the North American market and they are developed as a brand in themselves, if you like.

“The Mustang isn’t even badged Ford so it can have an entire life of its own. With the Explorer no one ever says they own a Ford, they say they’ve got an Explorer, or an F150.

“The requirements of those customers are so specific, so North American-centric, that we’ve actually identified the products for which our design will remain in North America as being their brand and that the customer of that brand defines very much how those vehicles are.

“All around the rest of the world there’s a mix of vehicles mostly coming from Europe which subscribe to the One Ford design DNA.”

Mr Smith said that while the downsizing trend was also evident in the US, full-size pick-up trucks and SUVs would always attract strong demand.

“It’s been declared that several plants have been redesigned to take small cars and that’s certainly one of the emerging trends in the US, but F150 trucks are not going to go away. They might become more fuel-efficient.

“The F150 brand is migrating more towards a business tool rather than a recreational vehicle and the Explorer and larger SUVs, which again is something very American-centric, and the requirement is definitely there in the market.

“I’m sure they will get more aerodynamic and more efficient, but that format of vehicle – the size – is something which the North American customer is demanding and I couldn’t advocate that we stop doing that and make some more cars because that’s not what the market’s asking us to do,” he said.

imugli · 27-04-2009, 06:18 PM

Interesting article but not exactly HUGE news, considering most major makers (including Toyota) do this.

Tundra isn't sold anywhere else in the world.
The Mazda 6 is a different car over there than the rest of the world.
The reason there are 2 Honda Accord models is because they went down a different road in america to the rest of the world.
America has the volume to be able to demand that these models exist separately to the outside world - reason being that they are able to ammortise development costs over much larger production numbers.

Problem with Oz is that we are such a small market overall, you really can't justify spending $1 billion or more developing a platform that will sell 25 - 30,000 examples a year any more, thus we become part of Ford's One World, whether we like it or not.

Passions aside, it makes business sense.

Zed7fiddy · 27-04-2009, 06:25 PM

They say that the msutang and explorer and f150 only have markets on the USA, if import tax wasnt so stupid, and they built these vehicles in RHD, they would open up a crazy market here and in other countries!

But taxes and LHD - RHD conversions price them out of australians hands!

Ohio XB · 28-04-2009, 02:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 67-FKD

They say that the msutang and explorer and f150 only have markets on the USA, if import tax wasnt so stupid, and they built these vehicles in RHD, they would open up a crazy market here and in other countries!

But taxes and LHD - RHD conversions price them out of australians hands!

Another consideration is the price of fuel in other countries, and especially as it begins to go up again this summer season (northern hemisphere). In Europe where petrol is $6 - $8 a gallon they do not want heavy, large vehicles like the F150 and Explorer. In the US the people want these vehicles but only the price of petrol has brought sales down (before the economic downturn). As Ford improves these vehicles with better aerodynamics, weight reductions, and improved engine efficiency you will see sales start to climb again.

The regular guy used to be Ford's biggest customer for F150's. Now ford is marketing them much more to businesses and entrepeneurs. They realize that less regular guys are going to be buying them because of fuel prices so they are going after the "tool use" business more aggressively.

Americans want larger vehicles, without going into details as to why. The only reason for the move to smaller vehicles has been fuel prices. If that element is not a concern Americans buy more of the larger vehicles. Look at the 1990's when fuel was plain cheap. I rest my case. Americans bought what they wanted.

After the price of fuel came down from $4 a gallon sales of small vehicles dropped like a rock. Sales of larger vehicles started to pick up again. It is what Americans want.

As mentioned we also have the economy of scale to justify these vehicles in our market.

Ford is working dilligently to adapt these vehicles to be more fuel efficient and to hit that magical number where people say "Yeah, I can pay that much for gas for this thing".

The Mustang has a cult following. Often it is not their daily driver so that helps to negate the cost of fuel for it. Others are willing to part with the money for fuel for the enjoyment that the car provides them.

I am not going to pretend I know plenty about the Australian car market because I don't, but I understand Ford's approach to this. I do hope that the Falcon continues as an Australian designed, RWD car. I can relate this to the Mustang. It's in your hearts, but people's hearts need to be in the showroom signing papers too.

Steve

Paull · 28-04-2009, 03:43 AM

It will either work (Falcon) or it wont (Taurus). Quite simple really.

FordACE · 28-04-2009, 10:39 AM

I don't own a ford either, I own a falcon. If it wasn't for the falcon, I probably wouldn't be in a ford.

Seems like they dont' want to globalise their american market (any excuse will do) but everywhere else is fine. I definetly won't be buying anything fwd from ford if it's ever the case we lose the falcon...

Mr Hardware · 28-04-2009, 10:48 AM

Quote:

I don't own a ford either, I own a falcon. If it wasn't for the falcon, I probably wouldn't be in a ford.

Seconded.

LeadFoot81 · 28-04-2009, 11:20 AM

I own a Falcon but if I needed/wanted out of a sedan would happily switch to a Fiesta, Focus, Territory, Mondeo (a RHD Mustang would be a nice option too)

I can understand where Ford US are coming from with this and its no big deal.

atec77 · 28-04-2009, 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeadFoot81

I own a Falcon but if I needed/wanted out of a sedan would happily switch to a Fiesta, Focus, Territory, Mondeo (a RHD Mustang would be a nice option too)

I can understand where Ford US are coming from with this and its no big deal.

When the Falcon stops being like the wagon I curently drive I will simply drive the Cooper S (240hp) a lot more and wont be a ford guy anymore , either supply what I want or like thousands of others I wont be a customer

BOSSGT302 · 28-04-2009, 01:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FordACE

I don't own a ford either, I own a falcon. If it wasn't for the falcon, I probably wouldn't be in a ford.

Funny thing is my BF GT Falcon has very nice FORD badges front and rear, so i beleive i own a ford, And the good wifes Focus is just the same FORD badges front and rear. So we both own FORDS!!! Both FORD products do a fine job, and we did drive other vehicles before making decision to buy. Cheers BOSS302

Seems like they dont' want to globalise their american market (any excuse will do) but everywhere else is fine. I definetly won't be buying anything fwd from ford if it's ever the case we lose the falcon...

.

FORD look like they know how to do business, don't need Billions for US Gov, (but it may have helped) If looking after the US market (there biggest) and have another plan for the rest of us works for FORD, good luck to them. Somehow at the end of the day there will be a FORD for you and me, from Petrol Head to eco wise. I will keep supporting FORD as i have done for the last 2 score.

Blue_XR · 28-04-2009, 01:18 PM

Yes, I agree that having a FWD Falcon might be detrimental to the Ford brand in Australia. On the other hand I dont understand why they dont develop the Mustang/F150/F250 for RHD. Now would be a perfect opportunity to develp a GRWD platform for Falcon and Mustang. As Ford in Australia have a wealth of knowledge when it comes to RWD.

Have you guys seen the prices of used F250's? People are asking what they paid for them brand new, so im sure there is a market for them in Australia.

Also does an F150 compete directly with a Hilux or is F150 a size bigger? I would like to see this in the current line up.

Even if these trucks were introduced to an australian market but with an lpg option, im sure business would use the purposeful vehicles.

Personally im not a fan of the Ford NA passanger cars but I am a fan of their truck range and if there is a market outside the USA and particularly RHD markets then I think they should really look into this.

imugli · 28-04-2009, 01:51 PM

VDC in Mlebourne still do imports but $100k for an F150 HD???

That's a Super Pursuit and a focus for the missus!

R-Design · 28-04-2009, 02:22 PM

This is the first real weakness I’ve seen in the ‘One Ford’ policy. It sends the message that Ford is only willing to think globally where it suits the US. We don’t have have a Fiesta sized vehicle so we’ll adopt the European model. Our Focus is out of date so we’ll update inline with the global model cycle.

One ford should mean that Ford actively seeks to rationalise model duplication across the globe regardless of the current success or market. If an F series can be built off the same platform as a T6 Ranger this should be investigated. If a Mustang platform can be shared with a Falcon, why not? Cost cutting through model sharing can only serve to improve the breed of each model, lower R&D costs, and increase profitability. It would also serve to justify investment in projects which otherwise would not be profitable as stand alone products (i.e. Falcon).

Hopefully this is just a piece of fluff designed to let the American faithful sleep easier at night while the real work is done behind the scenes. If not Ford may not be as far behind GM as we think.

Stattic · 28-04-2009, 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Hardware

Seconded.

thirded

EgoFG · 29-04-2009, 12:02 AM

Hmmm I6 gas in an F150 anyone ?
That and Mustang, Crown Vic, and Falcon sharing a platform !

Ohio XB · 29-04-2009, 02:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boss315

This is the first real weakness I’ve seen in the ‘One Ford’ policy. It sends the message that Ford is only willing to think globally where it suits the US. We don’t have have a Fiesta sized vehicle so we’ll adopt the European model. Our Focus is out of date so we’ll update inline with the global model cycle.

The F150 has been the number one selling vehicle in the US for 27 years in a row. Last year Ford sold over half a million.....in a slow year. Its been the number one selling truck for 32 years in a row. There is definately a demand for this vehicle in the US.

As imugli posted a few posts ago, AU$100k for a pick-up truck? Not being too familiar with the Aussie market I would think one would prefer getting a home for that much money before a truck. In places like Europe and Asia where people are used to getting 40 - 60 MPG what do they want a truck that gets 20 MPG with a good tailwind, sometimes, for? The Transit already does better than that and is available in so many configurations. Granted, there are always going to be a few people that want an F150, but I don't believe enough to tool up a new plant to build them there. If Ford thought they could make money selling this truck in other parts of the world they would.

The Hilux is called the Tacoma in the US. It is now considered a mid-sized truck but until it was recently built on the new Land Cruiser chassis it was considered a compact truck. Toyota built the Tundra (full-sized truck) to compete with the F150, even naming it the T150 to associate it with the Ford truck's toughness. Ford took issue with this and the name got changed to Tundra before it was launched. Watching videos of comparisons between the two trucks shows which one is meant for work. Also, ask owners of F-series trucks about their experience with the proud Tundra owners when working together. The tailgates on the Tundras can't take a load and collapse. The Tundra bed rides much lower than the F150 when transfering the same load from the Ford to the Toyota. The bed on the Toyota shimmies like crazy on rough roads, causing traction problems, due to the lack of frame strength. There's plenty more.

As far as Ford adopting Euro vehicles for the US market, it only makes dollars and sense. Ford needs vehicles like these in the US. They have ignored cars to a degree for years. The quickest, cheapest way to do this is to use designs where all the engineering and development have already been done and the end product already enjoys a great reputation. One of the first things Mulally said at Ford was "The Mondeo is a great car. Why don't we have that here?" That's an outsider's unbiased view.

As far as thinking globally only where it suits the US, you are correct. Ford is a US based company and if it can make money selling the F150 in Australia in volume at $100K they will jump at that opportunity, but after the hardcore Aussies that want to pay this much for one get their's, what is Ford going to do with the rest of the trucks? What do you think annual sales volume will be over the course of 5 years at that price or around that price? Even if they tooled up to build them there and lowered the cost, how many would they be selling? Like I said, I am not an expert on the Aussie vehicle market. Would it be more than the Falcon?

Steve

Blue_XR · 29-04-2009, 10:25 AM

Ohio XB, when Ford Australia was selling the F-250 I think the price was around the $60k-$80K Aus mark. My only reason in stating this was that the Toyota Hilux is a very popular vehicle and its sells about 3000+ vehicles a month and and if Ford could introduce something that could take a higher payload and with more space then more people might take this option and pay more for it and the F150 does have a nicer interior to go with it. Its not just the Australian market, I was talking about RHD markets all around the world.

JMO · 29-04-2009, 10:29 AM

So the way I'm reading this is. The US keeps all models ie F150, Explorer etc as they are 'proven' sellers, while we are at risk of losing a 'proven' seller in the Falcon. (Admittedly sales are not as high as they could be).

People say they own an 'Explorer' or an 'F150'. Well _I_ say 'I own a Falcon'.

I'm not sure how long the current Mustang platform has been around for, but I'm sure the current Falcon platform blows it out of the water. So why not use the Falcon as the base for the Mustang?

If I'm reading into this incorrectly then please correct me, but it seems as though we're being screwed with 'One Ford' while the US made vehicles continue on untouched.

Blue_XR · 29-04-2009, 10:33 AM

I would definately prefer to keep the falcon and have it develped in LHD. This could be exported to the middle east and it could compete with holden in the same market. The falcon beats any US made passenger vehicle, especailly when the competition would be the Lincilon town car or the crown victoria

LeadFoot81 · 29-04-2009, 12:06 PM

If we get 'screwed' out of the Falcon it will because there is no business case for it. How many hardcore falcon-only enthusiasts on here buy their Falcons new?

I dont thinks its fair to be ****ed at Fomoco for sticking to a winning formula re: f-trucks and the Stang.

R-Design · 29-04-2009, 01:18 PM

LeadFoot I can see where you’re coming from, but the market is constantly changing. Traditionally the F-Series has had the market tied up in the US but now under threat from the Toyota Tundra and even VW is working on the Robust 4x4 Ute. Similarly the Mustang was without worthy competition before the Camaro & Challenger hit the market.

It’s a bit naïve to think that with this new direct competition that Ford sales won’t be affected. If Ford allows the Falcon to die now, in five or ten years time when there’s no business case to justify a new Mustang they’ll be wishing they had an OS model they could share a platform with. By which time none of us in Oz will give a toss!

JMO · 29-04-2009, 01:20 PM

So why were they pushing to have the Taurus to replace the Falcon in the past and even now possibly have something else rebadged as a falcon, when they won't even consider doing it to one of the US only models? (Crown Vic I'm looking at you).

I'm not ****ed, just trying to get a clearer picture of what is actually going on.

EgoFG · 29-04-2009, 02:03 PM

There are no public plans on the future of the Panther platform (Crown Vic/Grand Marquis/Town Car) beyond 2010.

There are plans for a Falcon beyond 2010 (although implied as Au only)

I did not see full year 2008 figures, but the panther platform is was dipping toward 80,000 per year in mid 2008 - on an old platform.

If the Falcon and Panther were 'merged' - 'designed in Australia, manufactured in Aust/USA' then sales would likely start at 80,000-100,000 per year in the USA, plus what ... 30,000-40,000 here.

The obstacle may be police sales - the CV currently used can handle a 80 k(?)pm rear hit - no other US car has stood up to this (AFAIK) - can the Falcon ?

Road_Warrior · 29-04-2009, 02:58 PM

Hang on a minute - where does it say anything about Taurus and Falcon being one and the same eventually? Nowhere. The person quoted in the article was merely giving a general overview about how One Ford works and why it might not apply to certain volume selling products in certain markets. This article quotes a European design director who would have no immediate knowledge on what is happening with Falcon OR Taurus - his job is to know his design portfolio in his own region, not ours.

What he said and the gist of the article as it relates to volume sellers like the F-Series makes perfect sense to me.

JPFS1 · 29-04-2009, 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JMO

So why were they pushing to have the Taurus to replace the Falcon in the past and even now possibly have something else rebadged as a falcon, when they won't even consider doing it to one of the US only models? (Crown Vic I'm looking at you).

I'm not ****ed, just trying to get a clearer picture of what is actually going on.

Nobody knows what's really going on, it's mostly speculation based on some small bits of info that Ford are choosing, carefully, to release, ie "One Ford".

The One Ford strategy can be interpreted in many ways, from complete platform sharing, ie to replace an existing obsolete platform, component/supplier sharing and a pooling of global resources and collaboration for research and development or it could be all these things.

I don't see "One Ford" as a strategy that spells out the death knell for Falcon. Many positive scenarios can play out for Falcon and Ford AUS generally.

In the shorter term, what I think will certainly happen to Falcon will be the introduction of global powertrains. We'll see Ecoboost and a new global V8. How they choose to implement these changes is still up in the air!!! They have world class labs here and production/testing facilities, so if it's viable, I wouldn't be surprised to see the new engines manufactured and developed here for various models that reach out to the Asia-Pacific Regions (ie global Focus).

As soon as this is done, Falcon, will definitely have more global appeal. One thing I am cautious of though is the importance of platforms that have developed heritage and a pedigree. These are the models that need to remain true to what made them icons in their respective markets in the first place - and Falcon is one of them. In other words, I certainly don't want to see a FWD Taurus replace the Australian Falcon! That will not be the answer.

In my opinion, the strategy of the global Fiesta needs to be seen as completely different to the strategy and requirements of a large RWD sedan... meaning that just because the "One Ford" Fiesta seems to be a great success, doesn't mean the same will eventuate for a large RWD program. Different market, different perceptions and psychology involved. This is where I believe they have to be very careful as to how far they want to go with "One Ford" and the whole platform sharing idea.

Trends change quickly sure, but knee jerk reactions to these changes simply aren't the answer imho. I think the most important point for a company's strength in the future is to have flexible manufacturing and working conditions, diverse and an appealing model mix in many different markets.

JPFS1 · 29-04-2009, 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EgoFG

The obstacle may be police sales - the CV currently used can handle a 80 k(?)pm rear hit - no other US car has stood up to this (AFAIK) - can the Falcon ?

Ummmm.... ;)

vztrt · 29-04-2009, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EgoFG

The obstacle may be police sales - the CV currently used can handle a 80 k(?)pm rear hit - no other US car has stood up to this (AFAIK) - can the Falcon ?

Pretty sure it can be designed to comply. At a large amount of units you would have a business case.

Apparently the commodore is trying to get this market.

http://www.fordforums.com.au/showpos...3&postcount=65

GT69 · 29-04-2009, 03:31 PM

Thats great news for GMH, and they might be able to palm off the W427 as a highway pursuit special

Road_Warrior · 29-04-2009, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JPFS1

Nobody knows what's really going on, it's mostly speculation based on some small bits of info that Ford are choosing, carefully, to release, ie "One Ford".

The One Ford strategy can be interpreted in many ways, from complete platform sharing, ie to replace an existing obsolete platform, component/supplier sharing and a pooling of global resources and collaboration for research and development or it could be all these things.

I don't see "One Ford" as a strategy that spells out the death knell for Falcon. Many positive scenarios can play out for Falcon and Ford AUS generally.

In the shorter term, what I think will certainly happen to Falcon will be the introduction of global powertrains. We'll see Ecoboost and a new global V8. How they choose to implement these changes is still up in the air!!! They have world class labs here and production/testing facilities, so if it's viable, I wouldn't be surprised to see the new engines manufactured and developed here for various models that reach out to the Asia-Pacific Regions (ie global Focus).

As soon as this is done, Falcon, will definitely have more global appeal. One thing I am cautious of though is the importance of platforms that have developed heritage and a pedigree. These are the models that need to remain true to what made them icons in their respective markets in the first place - and Falcon is one of them. In other words, I certainly don't want to see a FWD Taurus replace the Australian Falcon! That will not be the answer.

In my opinion, the strategy of the global Fiesta needs to be seen as completely different to the strategy and requirements of a large RWD sedan... meaning that just because the "One Ford" Fiesta seems to be a great success, doesn't mean the same will eventuate for a large RWD program. Different market, different perceptions and psychology involved. This is where I believe they have to be very careful as to how far they want to go with "One Ford" and the whole platform sharing idea.

Trends change quickly sure, but knee jerk reactions to these changes simply aren't the answer imho. I think the most important point for a company's strength in the future is to have flexible manufacturing and working conditions, diverse and an appealing model mix in many different markets.

I think you're right. Also, I think that in reference to the global Fiesta, it needs to be understood that it was intended to be (and will be) a volume seller, whereas RWD large cars like the Falcon will become more-or-less niche models, and henceforth the One Ford thing will be used differently.

cosmo20btt · 29-04-2009, 04:20 PM

The problem I have is that when Auto companies make extreme changes, & they are not always for the best, companies will never go backwards straight away even if it is in there best interests as they do not like to show that they can make mistakes. So the customer may have to wait years before they decide to bring on a "new model" that was fitted with the
old features that were once popular ie: XF without v8 ten years later EB with "new v8 option".