Re-cap tyres should be banned ?

GTP 320 · 09-06-2005, 05:07 PM

What is your opinions about Re-cap tyers on trucks etc,i personally think that they should be banned on the big heavy trucks such as semi trailors,they create a hazard when they blow off and litter the Highways around Australia.
One just has to go on a drive in the country roads and see all the bits and pieces of the re -caps littering the side of the roads and causing dangerous hazards while navigating the Highways.
I'm amazed that the Governments havent stepped in yet and tried to ban these re-caps.
Cheers John

Laminge · 09-06-2005, 05:09 PM

Try driving along side a 18w as a tyre is starting to shread and heads your direction

50cent 1cent 50cent 1cent gives new meaning

Soundwarp · 09-06-2005, 05:12 PM

Road worthy no!
But they are cool for burnout tyres!

Twisted · 09-06-2005, 05:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Laminge

50cent 1cent 50cent 1cent gives new meaning

I know what you mean!

Yeah definately not safe and something that should be banned. What is the cost comparison between a new truck tyre and a re-tread? Do they save a significant amount of money or what?

Feathers · 09-06-2005, 05:28 PM

New tyres for heavy vehicles are damn expensive. I don't know what the cost saving is for getting retreads.
My family has a bus company and buying new tyres for 13 vehicles, and having spares costs big $$$.
The bigger the company purchasing them is though I would assume that they would get a discount for bulk buys, but for smaller family or owner operators it's much more expensive.
Having said that we don't buy retreads, as it's not worth it if you have a problem with them, and people get injured or killed.

TheSneakiness · 09-06-2005, 05:47 PM

What I hate is when the council decide to mow the median on the Bruce Highway and the tractor blades spit the blow-outs on the road. I have a nice reminder of that on my EA. I was so tempted to get out, grab the thing and throw it back at the guy on the tractor.

Soundwarp · 09-06-2005, 05:54 PM

Dude that sux!

smoo · 09-06-2005, 05:59 PM

Or when some tight **** decides to save about $30 a tyre by buying retreads but won't do 5kmh over the limit cos the TV ad said it was dangerous :MrT_anim:

LOWAU · 09-06-2005, 06:40 PM

Re-cap tyres should be banned for use on cars but not on big trucks as it costs a lot of money to replace 18+ wheels.
Maybe just use the recaps on the back of the truck and not on front tyres that steer.

Even aeroplanes use recaps.

galaxy xr8 · 09-06-2005, 07:32 PM

I can uderstand that they should be banned and are very dangerous to drive on but on the other hand I see were the owner's/company of these big rig's buy them because with the amount of klm's travelled a yr they soon add up very costly,that's why retread's are so popular.

MITCHAY · 09-06-2005, 08:40 PM

If they bought new tyres then the costs would be passed on to consumers. I dont see how it could have a detrimental affect to a truck with 18 wheels. But on a car one blow out with only 4 tyres seems a lot more dangerous to me.

XRQTOR · 09-06-2005, 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MITCHAY

If they bought new tyres then the costs would be passed on to consumers. I dont see how it could have a detrimental affect to a truck with 18 wheels. But on a car one blow out with only 4 tyres seems a lot more dangerous to me.

Correct. Thats the same reason why steer tyres are not allowed to be retreads.

MO · 09-06-2005, 10:25 PM

There's a difference between recaps and retreads...recaps involve putting on another layer of treaded rubber....retreads involve putting deeper grooves on an almost bald tyre.
I have seen brand new tyres shred themselves on cars and trucks,imo retreads are more dangerous than recaps.

Having said that one of the most reliable recaps used to be Bandag they used a cold glueing process,I put a set on the 4x4 I used to own and got 80,000 odd out of them,in the N.T. no speed limit.

XRQTOR · 09-06-2005, 10:33 PM

Just think of how many retreads are used each year, then work out how much it'd cost to dump that many gutted tyres that can no longer be used. Not to mention a new retread is only about 6o% the cost of a new tyre.

dogbreath_48 · 09-06-2005, 11:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AUII_SE_Ute

What I hate is when the council decide to mow the median on the Bruce Highway and the tractor blades spit the blow-outs on the road. I have a nice reminder of that on my EA. I was so tempted to get out, grab the thing and throw it back at the guy on the tractor.

Not such a rare thing as i imagined: I've had a chunk make a big mess of a 3mm sheetmetal mud guard. That was on the hume at 110 too..coulda been nasty.

-Stu

sfr rob · 09-06-2005, 11:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Twisted

I know what you mean!

Yeah definately not safe and something that should be banned. What is the cost comparison between a new truck tyre and a re-tread? Do they save a significant amount of money or what?

HUGE SAVING!
I bought new tyres for my truck a few months ago, $700 each!
re-cap.... $150 tops! thats why we RE-TREAD! soo much cheaper!

sfr rob · 09-06-2005, 11:31 PM

from the horses mouth...

High quality tyres for heavy trucks and buses retail for around $550 to $600 per tyre. Prices for cheaper versions start in the range $350 to $400. A retread on a casing supplied by the customer costs $200 to $250. The price for a good quality casing is currently $50 to $70, which is a substantial reduction from recent prices which were in the range $120 to $130. Clearly, at the previous price levels, retreads would be uncompetitive with new tyres at the low end of the price range.

good night

smciner1 · 09-06-2005, 11:34 PM

I can't say dodging bits and pieces of shredded truck tyre on the highway is one of my favorire past times.

:SaiyanSmi

sfr rob · 09-06-2005, 11:38 PM

Advice from industry is that there is little difference in the expected life of new truck tyres at different prices. The life of the tread is approximately 150,000 to 200,000 km for tyres fitted to the drive wheels, and perhaps double this figure for tyres on the trailer wheels.

However, low quality tyres are not so suitable for retreading. The life of the casing for high quality tyres is of the order of 600,000 to 700,000 km. Clearly, unless the vehicle owner derives some value from the fact that the casing can be retreaded, there is little incentive to purchase the more expensive tyres. The relatively high value of casings reflects the high proportion of truck tyres that are retreaded; many truck tyres are retreaded multiple times.

XRQTOR · 09-06-2005, 11:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sfr rob

HUGE SAVING!
I bought new tyres for my truck a few months ago, $700 each!
re-cap.... $150 tops! thats why we RE-TREAD! soo much cheaper!

What do you drive mate.

pauljh74 · 10-06-2005, 12:22 AM

Truck tyres - at least the higher quality ones - are designed to be re-treaded/re-capped. The cornering forces on truck tyres you could say are relatively lower as most trucks don't hoon round corners. The more important feature is load carrying ability.

Passenger car tyres aren't designed to be re-treaded/re-capped and I think they should be banned as they perform much worse than a brand name passenger tyre that is priced fairly cheaply.

MNM96 · 10-06-2005, 09:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John McMaster

There's a difference between recaps and retreads...recaps involve putting on another layer of treaded rubber....retreads involve putting deeper grooves on an almost bald tyre.
I have seen brand new tyres shred themselves on cars and trucks,imo retreads are more dangerous than recaps.

Having said that one of the most reliable recaps used to be Bandag they used a cold glueing process,I put a set on the 4x4 I used to own and got 80,000 odd out of them,in the N.T. no speed limit.

Hey John and All,
A recap and a retread are essentially the same thing. It is where a ney layer of tread is bonded onto a scrubbed down case. The process of cutting a deeper groove is called regrooving. I do not know anyone in the trucking industry that regrooves a tyre anymore.

As for costs, I work for a company with a fleet of 60 Primemovers and about 200 Trailers. We estimate that we save about $2000000 a year by using Retreads.

A truck which loses a tread is also required to stop and pick up the remains, but little do. Also, a new tyre can fail and toss a tread, so tyre failure is not restricted to recaps. Tyre companies say that 65% of tyre failures are attributed to impact, where the tyre has struck something, so this would affect any tyre.

Lastly, if you a driving along and your car is damaged by debris from a roadside mower, stop and bring it to the mower dudes attn. I don't know how you would go with a Contractor, but the council will pay for the damage. I had the windscreen and 2 lights replaced and the front bar and bonnet repainted, after being "attacked" by the roadside mower.

Cheers,
Mike

10-06-2005, 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Laminge

Try driving along side a 18w as a tyre is starting to shread and heads your direction

50cent 1cent 50cent 1cent gives new meaning

yes well i know how that feels. so does the car. when your stuck in full bumper to bumber traffic on the F3 doing 110 to sydney and one shoots out and smacks the front of the car. and you cant dodge it.

They should be banned. but im sure h/duty trucks cant put recaps on the steer wheels.

10-06-2005, 12:44 PM

As someone mentioned maybe ban them from airplanes too because every airline retreads their tyres as well.

On trucks the steers must be clean skins but the rest are open to retreading. Some companies still believe clean skins are better overall because there is a definite lowering of costs related to truck damage and downtime when retreads aren't used (the company I occasionally drive for uses clean skins 100% because of the express freight they carry).

A bigger question comes in our tolerance of retreads on cars. The TAC and other intelligence-challenged organisations will fine an FPV/HSV driver for doing 65 in a 60 zone but the taxi running retreads that take over 20% longer to stop than an OEM tyre are never challenged. Yes, it's fact that on a Falcodore a retread takes at least 20% longer to stop than the OEM tyre fitted from new, let alone a quality/performance tyre. That more than makes up for driving at 60 versus 65 km/h.

So, why don't they attack this problem? With car tyres costing a paltry $100 it's not a significant impost on car owners.

xbcoupe302 · 10-06-2005, 01:52 PM

i use to run retreads on the back of my wagon y would i pay $150 for a tyre that dosnt grip aswell as a retread for $65 and plus the car had a spool so maxium kays i got out of the rear tyres where 8000klms.

and b4 ppl say they r dangerous i never once had a blow out or the tyre peeled or anything like that.

megsy · 10-06-2005, 02:37 PM

along with regrooving and recaps ive heard of remoulds, whats this process involve and is it any safer than recaps ect?

dogbreath_48 · 10-06-2005, 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by megsy

along with regrooving and recaps ive heard of remoulds, whats this process involve and is it any safer than recaps ect?

Remoulds include a new layer or rubber over the sidewall of the tyre too. The problem with this is it's sometimes hard to tell what type of tyre the original carcass is from. Once company making off road re-treads was found to be using road car carcass'; shithouse.
I can't say i'd use re-treads/re-caps/re-moulds on a car - even a trailer is pushing it. However, I don't think there's a super significant risk from trucks with multiple axels and dual tyres using them.

-Stu

bazzalong · 10-06-2005, 08:12 PM

[QUOTE=Aussie Pete]As someone mentioned maybe ban them from airplanes too because every airline retreads their tyres as well.

If my information is correct, and im sure it is (might not be!), a retread is where they glue a new tread on, a recap is where they glue it to the sidewalls aswell, and a remould is where they re-mould new rubber around the old carcass.

planes use remoulds, which get regrooved every 5 landings i think.

the tyre companies claim that a remould is just as safe as a normal tyre, as they remove 80-90% of the rubber on the flat of the tyre, and i think its 30% of the sidewall......

so what you get, is essentially a new tyre, as the process for building a tyre from scratch does the same thing, remoulding cuts out the first 40% of labour and materials of a new tyre.
they have regulations and testing for this stuff......

but i do agree, ban retreads, i had one let go on me at 100Kph, flipped my Xfiancee's dads subaru, can any1 say "Write Off"?????

MO · 10-06-2005, 10:07 PM

AP;
I gather from your posts your in the trucking game...one word for retreads Michelin....scrub out one letter for each retread and you can get eight out of a cleanskin .

FTR302 · 10-06-2005, 10:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LOWAU

Re-cap tyres should be banned for use on cars but not on big trucks as it costs a lot of money to replace 18+ wheels.
Maybe just use the recaps on the back of the truck and not on front tyres that steer.

Even aeroplanes use recaps.

No trucks are allowed to have re-caps on the front, it's illegal. They have to have new ones.